1 00:00:08,759 --> 00:00:05,190 you're tuned in tonight vision radio 2 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:08,769 exposing the truth one secret at a time 3 00:00:14,049 --> 00:00:11,570 prepare yourself as we explore the 4 00:00:17,859 --> 00:00:14,059 shadow worlds of suppressed history 5 00:00:20,259 --> 00:00:17,869 secret knowledge forbidden religion and 6 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:20,269 shine a light on the conspiracies to 7 00:01:02,920 --> 00:00:36,430 [Music] 8 00:01:02,930 --> 00:01:09,840 welcome to night-vision radio 9 00:01:14,110 --> 00:01:12,130 welcome welcome everybody to 10 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:14,120 night-vision radio I'm Renee Barnett 11 00:01:18,310 --> 00:01:16,730 your host and I'm really excited about 12 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:18,320 tonight's show because it's something 13 00:01:23,980 --> 00:01:21,410 I've not done a show on which is unusual 14 00:01:27,040 --> 00:01:23,990 this is a brand new subject for night 15 00:01:30,370 --> 00:01:27,050 vision and we are going to be exploring 16 00:01:33,130 --> 00:01:30,380 the world of owls in their relationship 17 00:01:37,120 --> 00:01:33,140 to high strangeness and synchronicities 18 00:01:39,010 --> 00:01:37,130 and life and death and UFOs it's we're 19 00:01:40,960 --> 00:01:39,020 going to take a wild ride and we're 20 00:01:43,240 --> 00:01:40,970 going to have a lot of fun tonight 21 00:01:46,260 --> 00:01:43,250 hearing about this not only are we going 22 00:01:49,870 --> 00:01:46,270 to hear about you know symbology of owls 23 00:01:52,050 --> 00:01:49,880 owls and different cultures but we're 24 00:01:55,210 --> 00:01:52,060 also going to hear some personal stories 25 00:01:57,520 --> 00:01:55,220 including the personal story of my very 26 00:01:59,140 --> 00:01:57,530 special guest tonight Mike Cleland he's 27 00:02:02,260 --> 00:01:59,150 written a book called the messengers 28 00:02:05,410 --> 00:02:02,270 owls synchronicity and the UFO abductees 29 00:02:08,410 --> 00:02:05,420 and it contains a lot of his own 30 00:02:10,810 --> 00:02:08,420 personal experiences as he was grappling 31 00:02:14,199 --> 00:02:10,820 with what might be going on in his own 32 00:02:17,979 --> 00:02:14,209 life which ended up sort of changing his 33 00:02:20,949 --> 00:02:17,989 life and then he also began to research 34 00:02:23,470 --> 00:02:20,959 the entire subject and gathering stories 35 00:02:26,830 --> 00:02:23,480 and personal accounts in all kinds of 36 00:02:29,530 --> 00:02:26,840 information and data in history so you 37 00:02:31,990 --> 00:02:29,540 can't say anything about owls that Mike 38 00:02:33,970 --> 00:02:32,000 Cleland doesn't know I really think so 39 00:02:36,250 --> 00:02:33,980 I'd like to welcome Mike to the show 40 00:02:38,199 --> 00:02:36,260 tonight Mike thanks so much you're very 41 00:02:40,270 --> 00:02:38,209 welcome and there's lots I still need to 42 00:02:42,190 --> 00:02:40,280 learn about owls so yes it's a it's a 43 00:02:45,310 --> 00:02:42,200 it's a it's a journey yes but I feel 44 00:02:47,590 --> 00:02:45,320 like as far as the connection between 45 00:02:50,350 --> 00:02:47,600 the owls and the UFOs that's certainly 46 00:02:53,530 --> 00:02:50,360 been part of you know honestly like I 47 00:02:58,360 --> 00:02:53,540 read a lot of UFO books and there's a 48 00:03:00,430 --> 00:02:58,370 paragraph or so in a lot of UFO books 49 00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:00,440 specifically the abduction you know 50 00:03:05,290 --> 00:03:03,530 literature so there's other people had 51 00:03:07,150 --> 00:03:05,300 noted it and said you know there's this 52 00:03:09,490 --> 00:03:07,160 odd relationship to owls and then 53 00:03:10,290 --> 00:03:09,500 they'll mention a little story and in 54 00:03:12,940 --> 00:03:10,300 Whitley Strieber 55 00:03:16,090 --> 00:03:12,950 more than any one sort of launched that 56 00:03:19,330 --> 00:03:16,100 with Communion in 1986 when that came 57 00:03:21,070 --> 00:03:19,340 out excuse me 87 I believe it was when 58 00:03:24,670 --> 00:03:21,080 that came out and 59 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:24,680 so the you know but what I ended up 60 00:03:30,910 --> 00:03:26,330 doing I guess is just going kind of hog 61 00:03:32,199 --> 00:03:30,920 wild on it and just really trying to 62 00:03:34,750 --> 00:03:32,209 look at this from every angle I could 63 00:03:36,010 --> 00:03:34,760 and and part of that is based on as you 64 00:03:38,170 --> 00:03:36,020 as you mentioned my own personal 65 00:03:42,070 --> 00:03:38,180 experiences you're really delving into 66 00:03:46,350 --> 00:03:42,080 it yeah I I agree with you about that 67 00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:46,360 owl being a common experience among 68 00:03:51,699 --> 00:03:49,250 people who have had UFO experiences and 69 00:03:54,850 --> 00:03:51,709 as you clearly point out in your book 70 00:03:57,100 --> 00:03:54,860 that they're not only related to UFOs 71 00:04:01,449 --> 00:03:57,110 there's a lot of other things but I 72 00:04:05,740 --> 00:04:01,459 remember and it was back in the 80s when 73 00:04:09,750 --> 00:04:05,750 I actually was doing some research and I 74 00:04:12,130 --> 00:04:09,760 was a part of the founding group of 75 00:04:14,440 --> 00:04:12,140 what's called Cerro Close Encounters 76 00:04:16,150 --> 00:04:14,450 research organization which actually is 77 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:16,160 still ongoing today but I was one of the 78 00:04:19,780 --> 00:04:17,930 founders of that organization back in 79 00:04:22,690 --> 00:04:19,790 the 80s and that's what we were doing 80 00:04:26,020 --> 00:04:22,700 was studying people's experiences and we 81 00:04:28,659 --> 00:04:26,030 did have a lot of people that reported 82 00:04:30,940 --> 00:04:28,669 you know seeing an owl just before just 83 00:04:33,969 --> 00:04:30,950 after an experience somehow it was 84 00:04:37,060 --> 00:04:33,979 related we you know wondered whether it 85 00:04:38,409 --> 00:04:37,070 might be a screen memory or you know 86 00:04:42,790 --> 00:04:38,419 something else altogether 87 00:04:47,110 --> 00:04:42,800 but can you tell me about the first time 88 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:47,120 you know the owl subject matter sort of 89 00:04:54,670 --> 00:04:48,770 caught your attention through your own 90 00:04:56,980 --> 00:04:54,680 personal experience okay so it's 2017 91 00:04:57,460 --> 00:04:56,990 and I'm going to be 55 in a in a few 92 00:05:02,890 --> 00:04:57,470 weeks 93 00:05:08,110 --> 00:05:02,900 and this goes back to 2006 and I think I 94 00:05:09,850 --> 00:05:08,120 would have been 44 or just about to turn 95 00:05:11,260 --> 00:05:09,860 45 yes I would have been I would have 96 00:05:18,490 --> 00:05:11,270 turned 45 at that point I would have 97 00:05:21,340 --> 00:05:18,500 been 45 years old so this is I was 98 00:05:23,710 --> 00:05:21,350 living near Grand Teton National Park in 99 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:23,720 John the Wyoming border I was living in 100 00:05:29,980 --> 00:05:27,130 Idaho at the time and leading up to this 101 00:05:32,950 --> 00:05:29,990 like I had had a lot of experiences that 102 00:05:33,980 --> 00:05:32,960 I was denying and avoiding and it wasn't 103 00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:33,990 looking into and 104 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:36,690 and I was kind of digging in my heels 105 00:05:41,690 --> 00:05:40,170 and I was you know hiding from some 106 00:05:44,180 --> 00:05:41,700 things that that in retrospect were 107 00:05:48,340 --> 00:05:44,190 pretty obvious I had seen multiple UFOs 108 00:05:52,670 --> 00:05:48,350 I'd had missing time I'd even seen five 109 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:52,680 beings in my backyard five gray beings 110 00:05:55,610 --> 00:05:54,450 walking in my backyard I woke up one 111 00:05:58,070 --> 00:05:55,620 night and looked out the window and saw 112 00:05:59,990 --> 00:05:58,080 that now so so that you know this is all 113 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:00,000 in the background and I and I wasn't 114 00:06:05,030 --> 00:06:01,650 addressing it I wasn't focusing in on I 115 00:06:11,180 --> 00:06:05,040 was and at the same time I was reading 116 00:06:13,370 --> 00:06:11,190 UFO books somewhat obsessively so you 117 00:06:15,860 --> 00:06:13,380 don't if you don't mind could you put it 118 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:15,870 into context like in your life you know 119 00:06:20,960 --> 00:06:17,810 what kind of person were you were you a 120 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:20,970 UFO believer were you a skeptic were you 121 00:06:27,050 --> 00:06:23,250 a business person to me kind of give us 122 00:06:30,260 --> 00:06:27,060 a little snapshot of when the searchers 123 00:06:31,970 --> 00:06:30,270 started happening so I had some I had 124 00:06:34,580 --> 00:06:31,980 several events took place two of which 125 00:06:35,870 --> 00:06:34,590 happened when I was 12 years old one was 126 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:35,880 a missing time event that had an 127 00:06:42,740 --> 00:06:40,650 Associated bright light in the sky and I 128 00:06:44,150 --> 00:06:42,750 arrived home as a 12 year old boy and my 129 00:06:45,830 --> 00:06:44,160 parents were mad at me like why do you 130 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:45,840 doing out so late now it's not late 131 00:06:49,010 --> 00:06:47,130 and they pointed to the clock it was 132 00:06:53,570 --> 00:06:49,020 11:30 it should have been around 9:30 133 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:53,580 and they were they were angry I had no 134 00:06:57,740 --> 00:06:55,770 this is way before any the term missing 135 00:07:00,650 --> 00:06:57,750 time or anything this would've been 1974 136 00:07:04,850 --> 00:07:00,660 and I was just you know it didn't make 137 00:07:06,890 --> 00:07:04,860 any sense to me and I and I you know I 138 00:07:08,630 --> 00:07:06,900 kind of it just kind of rolled it just 139 00:07:13,130 --> 00:07:08,640 seemed like an odd event and in the the 140 00:07:16,370 --> 00:07:13,140 orange flash in the sky was very jarring 141 00:07:17,690 --> 00:07:16,380 and I can I get to go right to the point 142 00:07:19,430 --> 00:07:17,700 in the sidewalk where it happened in my 143 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:19,440 neighborhood and for some reason I knew 144 00:07:24,590 --> 00:07:21,090 exactly what time it should have been 145 00:07:25,880 --> 00:07:24,600 and I and I was somehow about between an 146 00:07:32,390 --> 00:07:25,890 hour and a half to two hours were 147 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:32,400 missing now and then the so I grew up in 148 00:07:35,930 --> 00:07:34,170 Michigan and I moved to New York City 149 00:07:38,240 --> 00:07:35,940 and was a yuppie for ten years and was 150 00:07:40,550 --> 00:07:38,250 very successful doing working freelance 151 00:07:42,650 --> 00:07:40,560 for advertising agencies and then I 152 00:07:44,750 --> 00:07:42,660 moved out west and gave all that up and 153 00:07:46,310 --> 00:07:44,760 completely threw myself into being a ski 154 00:07:47,309 --> 00:07:46,320 bum and I taught for an outdoor school 155 00:07:50,339 --> 00:07:47,319 and travel 156 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:50,349 Alaska every year for a decade and and 157 00:07:54,649 --> 00:07:52,210 top mountaineering in the big peaks of 158 00:07:57,029 --> 00:07:54,659 Alaska so I was doing you know I was 159 00:07:59,369 --> 00:07:57,039 doing some bold stuff as far as my own 160 00:08:01,320 --> 00:07:59,379 personal work and I also did a lot of a 161 00:08:07,409 --> 00:08:01,330 lot of backpacking a lot of camping a 162 00:08:09,629 --> 00:08:07,419 lot of sleeping outdoors now in and and 163 00:08:10,799 --> 00:08:09,639 then and I was oh I was certainly a 164 00:08:17,429 --> 00:08:10,809 believer in the sense that I was 165 00:08:19,469 --> 00:08:17,439 obsessively reading UFO books and and I 166 00:08:22,170 --> 00:08:19,479 was fascinated by the the abduction lore 167 00:08:23,699 --> 00:08:22,180 I was totally focused that's was that 168 00:08:24,689 --> 00:08:23,709 would just pick up one book read it all 169 00:08:28,769 --> 00:08:24,699 the way through pick up another book 170 00:08:31,019 --> 00:08:28,779 read it all the way through and and that 171 00:08:32,670 --> 00:08:31,029 was leading up to this event in 2006 172 00:08:34,199 --> 00:08:32,680 which is not that exciting of an event 173 00:08:36,029 --> 00:08:34,209 but here's what happened I there was a 174 00:08:39,059 --> 00:08:36,039 woman in town and her name is Kristin 175 00:08:40,589 --> 00:08:39,069 and she was working at the same school I 176 00:08:42,540 --> 00:08:40,599 was working at and I had been up in 177 00:08:45,329 --> 00:08:42,550 Alaska all year and this was October and 178 00:08:47,160 --> 00:08:45,339 the weather was beautiful at that time 179 00:08:48,389 --> 00:08:47,170 of the year and and I said oh you've 180 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:48,399 been here all summery she must have 181 00:08:51,269 --> 00:08:49,810 camped a whole lot and she's a night in 182 00:08:52,889 --> 00:08:51,279 camp once and I'm that's terrible let's 183 00:08:54,449 --> 00:08:52,899 go out I'll take you camping one night I 184 00:08:57,420 --> 00:08:54,459 do it all the time I just go out for one 185 00:08:59,370 --> 00:08:57,430 night so we we didn't even take a tent 186 00:09:00,960 --> 00:08:59,380 the weather was predicted to be lovely 187 00:09:02,009 --> 00:09:00,970 and clear and calm so we didn't take a 188 00:09:03,180 --> 00:09:02,019 tent and just hiked out into the 189 00:09:06,180 --> 00:09:03,190 mountains and slept out under the stars 190 00:09:10,189 --> 00:09:06,190 now there came a point when I was making 191 00:09:11,759 --> 00:09:10,199 dinner on a little camp stove and and 192 00:09:13,470 --> 00:09:11,769 Kristin and I were having this 193 00:09:14,790 --> 00:09:13,480 conversation and the Sun was setting and 194 00:09:16,829 --> 00:09:14,800 the moon was rising and we're in this 195 00:09:19,019 --> 00:09:16,839 field of wildflowers way high up in the 196 00:09:21,900 --> 00:09:19,029 mountains and the stars were coming out 197 00:09:23,250 --> 00:09:21,910 as just spectacular setting and and she 198 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:23,260 was started talking about something and 199 00:09:26,790 --> 00:09:24,490 I remember thinking like I'm impressed 200 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:26,800 this is fairly impressive I this is I 201 00:09:32,340 --> 00:09:30,010 didn't in essence a stranger you know 202 00:09:35,370 --> 00:09:32,350 and in here I was like wow this is 203 00:09:39,569 --> 00:09:35,380 really I'm really I was moved and 204 00:09:44,579 --> 00:09:39,579 impressed now at that moment an owl flew 205 00:09:47,970 --> 00:09:44,589 over us and then a second owl and then a 206 00:09:50,340 --> 00:09:47,980 third owl and for the next you know well 207 00:09:52,949 --> 00:09:50,350 over maybe two hours these owls flew 208 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:52,959 around us as we talked we set up you 209 00:09:56,309 --> 00:09:54,370 know we played our sleeping bags down on 210 00:09:58,230 --> 00:09:56,319 the ground and just slept out under the 211 00:10:00,990 --> 00:09:58,240 stars and these owls were flying above 212 00:10:01,340 --> 00:10:01,000 us and around us and as far as screen 213 00:10:02,780 --> 00:10:01,350 memory 214 00:10:04,700 --> 00:10:02,790 these were real owls there were out 215 00:10:06,860 --> 00:10:04,710 sighs they were doing owl things they 216 00:10:08,690 --> 00:10:06,870 were you know and so there's there's no 217 00:10:12,260 --> 00:10:08,700 question that these were real owls in my 218 00:10:13,820 --> 00:10:12,270 mind they weren't very big you know they 219 00:10:15,140 --> 00:10:13,830 were they were maybe you know standing 220 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:15,150 on the ground would have been maybe 221 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:19,250 twelve to fourteen inches tall so you 222 00:10:22,610 --> 00:10:21,090 know there was a point when you were 223 00:10:23,720 --> 00:10:22,620 lying your back and the owls are very 224 00:10:25,130 --> 00:10:23,730 quiet in the way they fly and you're 225 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:25,140 looking up at the you know the amazing 226 00:10:28,790 --> 00:10:27,210 stars at that elevation high up in the 227 00:10:31,820 --> 00:10:28,800 mountains and in a place without much 228 00:10:34,070 --> 00:10:31,830 light around much city light and and 229 00:10:35,860 --> 00:10:34,080 then the stars would just go the Stars 230 00:10:38,300 --> 00:10:35,870 would just go style or you know blank 231 00:10:40,010 --> 00:10:38,310 for just a half a second and the owls 232 00:10:41,810 --> 00:10:40,020 were flying down swooping in front of 233 00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:41,820 our faces as we were lying there was 234 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:45,690 just amazing experience so a couple days 235 00:10:50,330 --> 00:10:48,810 later I I you know we got up the next 236 00:10:51,770 --> 00:10:50,340 morning and hiked back into town and it 237 00:10:53,210 --> 00:10:51,780 was just amazing trip and we were both 238 00:10:55,070 --> 00:10:53,220 really excited and the owl thing seemed 239 00:10:56,570 --> 00:10:55,080 really cool and I said listen if I go 240 00:10:58,010 --> 00:10:56,580 camping again I'll all I asked you in 241 00:10:59,420 --> 00:10:58,020 she said great so a couple days later I 242 00:11:01,370 --> 00:10:59,430 said I'm gonna go in the mountains again 243 00:11:02,690 --> 00:11:01,380 it was actually four days later and she 244 00:11:04,270 --> 00:11:02,700 said I would love to go again so we went 245 00:11:06,470 --> 00:11:04,280 out to a different part of the mountains 246 00:11:08,300 --> 00:11:06,480 same thing one night this time the 247 00:11:12,950 --> 00:11:08,310 weather was a little more unsettled so 248 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:12,960 we took a tent and um and we it was kind 249 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:14,490 of cold actually so we hiked to this 250 00:11:19,250 --> 00:11:16,290 little peak to watch the sunset just 251 00:11:20,420 --> 00:11:19,260 this little hill and as we got the you 252 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:20,430 know we're gonna warm up right you warm 253 00:11:23,510 --> 00:11:21,930 up and then you walk back down and you 254 00:11:26,930 --> 00:11:23,520 nice and warm so when you get in a tent 255 00:11:28,370 --> 00:11:26,940 you're not gonna chilled so we um got to 256 00:11:30,950 --> 00:11:28,380 this hilltop and watch the sunset in 257 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:30,960 this owl landed on a branch and then 258 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:32,610 another owl was flying around us and a 259 00:11:37,190 --> 00:11:34,290 third eye was like landing in our feet 260 00:11:39,830 --> 00:11:37,200 and this time this time it was like they 261 00:11:44,810 --> 00:11:39,840 were so close they were like right there 262 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:44,820 standing like nearly at our feet and you 263 00:11:48,530 --> 00:11:46,530 have it happened once was pretty cool 264 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:48,540 but to have it happen twice with the 265 00:11:55,790 --> 00:11:50,610 same person and within four days was 266 00:11:59,510 --> 00:11:55,800 absolutely mystical now there's 267 00:12:01,190 --> 00:11:59,520 something that I it was so clear and I 268 00:12:04,750 --> 00:12:01,200 remembered at the time I never said it 269 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:04,760 at the time I'm saying it now both times 270 00:12:10,790 --> 00:12:08,130 seeing these owls I had this very clear 271 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:10,800 thought in my mind and it was this has 272 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:12,810 something to do with UFOs it was like a 273 00:12:17,850 --> 00:12:14,890 voice in my head that was a state 274 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:17,860 it's like this has something to do with 275 00:12:27,660 --> 00:12:25,330 the UFOs and and then it was it was now 276 00:12:29,340 --> 00:12:27,670 the the lore of the owl and this the 277 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:29,350 title of the book is their messengers 278 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:30,970 right so all throughout human history 279 00:12:36,060 --> 00:12:33,730 owls have you know native people can see 280 00:12:37,950 --> 00:12:36,070 owls they they all recognize that they 281 00:12:40,470 --> 00:12:37,960 fly in the dark they fly at night and 282 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:40,480 they very quickly becomes a metaphor all 283 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:42,850 in all cultures across I mean the owl 284 00:12:49,110 --> 00:12:45,850 lore is different on some respects all 285 00:12:52,650 --> 00:12:49,120 over but it's like at the core it's that 286 00:12:54,270 --> 00:12:52,660 owls it owls not only travel through the 287 00:12:56,610 --> 00:12:54,280 night but then they travel to other 288 00:12:59,310 --> 00:12:56,620 realms and they come back with a message 289 00:13:03,360 --> 00:12:59,320 this is this is you all across the world 290 00:13:07,830 --> 00:13:03,370 now so I was seeing an owls I got a I 291 00:13:09,840 --> 00:13:07,840 was got a powerful clear message this 292 00:13:12,900 --> 00:13:09,850 has something to do with UFOs it was it 293 00:13:14,910 --> 00:13:12,910 was it was both times just a ringing 294 00:13:15,930 --> 00:13:14,920 Bell in my head and like alarm going off 295 00:13:20,970 --> 00:13:15,940 and that's what the message was 296 00:13:23,010 --> 00:13:20,980 now some I wrote this up in my blog and 297 00:13:24,930 --> 00:13:23,020 I had and I started a blog in 2009 and 298 00:13:27,300 --> 00:13:24,940 at that point Kristen who I was camping 299 00:13:29,790 --> 00:13:27,310 with had moved out of the town that I 300 00:13:32,100 --> 00:13:29,800 was living in and um but I wrote up that 301 00:13:36,330 --> 00:13:32,110 little essay and I put it on my the very 302 00:13:38,190 --> 00:13:36,340 first day I did my my blog and and I 303 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:38,200 remember thinking as I posted it and 304 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:39,610 then after I posted I said you know what 305 00:13:42,710 --> 00:13:41,410 I even wrote it right in the essay that 306 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:42,720 she was saying something really 307 00:13:48,390 --> 00:13:46,210 you know touching at that moment and 308 00:13:50,220 --> 00:13:48,400 then a night contact her I said Kristen 309 00:13:51,990 --> 00:13:50,230 what are we saying at the moment we saw 310 00:13:53,580 --> 00:13:52,000 the first owls do you remember she said 311 00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:53,590 oh I don't clearly remember what I was 312 00:13:59,510 --> 00:13:56,250 saying I was giving my most heartfelt 313 00:14:01,710 --> 00:13:59,520 definition of what God meant to me and 314 00:14:03,930 --> 00:14:01,720 that's when the first all appeared now 315 00:14:05,790 --> 00:14:03,940 so this I mean I just this all these 316 00:14:10,050 --> 00:14:05,800 cluster of events and I will tell you 317 00:14:14,420 --> 00:14:10,060 when after those first owls and I was I 318 00:14:17,850 --> 00:14:14,430 was hit so hard with synchronicities and 319 00:14:19,770 --> 00:14:17,860 powerful coincidences all of them if he 320 00:14:23,550 --> 00:14:19,780 pulled on the thread somehow traced back 321 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:23,560 to UFO stuff and I started looking at my 322 00:14:27,650 --> 00:14:25,570 own UFO experiences and contacting 323 00:14:30,710 --> 00:14:27,660 people and talking to people and and 324 00:14:31,790 --> 00:14:30,720 abduction researchers and and talking to 325 00:14:34,670 --> 00:14:31,800 people who've had the direct contact 326 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:34,680 experience and one of the questions I 327 00:14:38,660 --> 00:14:36,330 asked everyone is have you had any 328 00:14:39,950 --> 00:14:38,670 experiences with owls and it's not a 329 00:14:43,340 --> 00:14:39,960 hundred percent obviously but there's 330 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:43,350 enough of a pattern that I really paid 331 00:14:47,230 --> 00:14:45,330 attention to it and it was partially was 332 00:14:49,460 --> 00:14:47,240 because this is was my own personal 333 00:14:51,590 --> 00:14:49,470 foundation in this thing that I that I 334 00:14:55,340 --> 00:14:51,600 just kept on asking that question and 335 00:14:58,130 --> 00:14:55,350 eventually it turned into like a theme 336 00:15:04,610 --> 00:14:58,140 on the on the blog and then eventually 337 00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:04,620 it took it turned into a like a like a 338 00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:06,240 eventually turned into a great big fat 339 00:15:13,340 --> 00:15:07,500 book that's almost four hundred pages 340 00:15:15,890 --> 00:15:13,350 long now that that was interesting that 341 00:15:17,360 --> 00:15:15,900 she did remember and that it was 342 00:15:19,610 --> 00:15:17,370 something so profound that she was 343 00:15:21,710 --> 00:15:19,620 speaking about at that time and then 344 00:15:23,810 --> 00:15:21,720 that was at the same moment that you 345 00:15:26,660 --> 00:15:23,820 know you actually get this message I 346 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:26,670 mean that sounds really interesting you 347 00:15:31,730 --> 00:15:30,090 know it's funny because in preparing for 348 00:15:34,490 --> 00:15:31,740 the show I was singing oh I wonder if I 349 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:34,500 have any synchronicities with owls and 350 00:15:38,660 --> 00:15:36,810 you know so I was looking up things 351 00:15:40,730 --> 00:15:38,670 about owls and doing a little research 352 00:15:42,410 --> 00:15:40,740 on owls myself and the first thing they 353 00:15:46,910 --> 00:15:42,420 kind of owls have night vision and I 354 00:15:48,050 --> 00:15:46,920 went like well of course one of the 355 00:15:49,550 --> 00:15:48,060 first I thought about it just a little 356 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:49,560 bit before we went online I was like 357 00:15:52,810 --> 00:15:50,610 wait a minute night vision that's 358 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:52,820 exactly yes so more than any other 359 00:15:58,640 --> 00:15:55,370 animal 360 00:16:00,620 --> 00:15:58,650 owls have by far I guess you know the 361 00:16:05,900 --> 00:16:00,630 best night vision of certainly of any 362 00:16:08,060 --> 00:16:05,910 bird and and yeah amazing night vision 363 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:08,070 to where they can fly or so they're 364 00:16:11,690 --> 00:16:09,930 flying around darting in and out of the 365 00:16:14,210 --> 00:16:11,700 trees right you know in and out of 366 00:16:20,210 --> 00:16:14,220 branches and stuff like that in complete 367 00:16:21,950 --> 00:16:20,220 darkness yes yeah absolutely it's pretty 368 00:16:24,260 --> 00:16:21,960 amazing you know of course when I chose 369 00:16:26,780 --> 00:16:24,270 the name for the show I wasn't thinking 370 00:16:28,330 --> 00:16:26,790 about Alice because I'm a you know I 371 00:16:32,330 --> 00:16:28,340 work in television and film production 372 00:16:35,570 --> 00:16:32,340 by profession and I you know we use 373 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:35,580 night-vision cameras to illuminate 374 00:16:39,970 --> 00:16:37,410 what's hidden in the dark so I thought 375 00:16:41,060 --> 00:16:39,980 that was a good little sort of metaphor 376 00:16:43,070 --> 00:16:41,070 for 377 00:16:45,200 --> 00:16:43,080 this kind of material that I do you know 378 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:45,210 we try on this show to illuminate what's 379 00:16:49,670 --> 00:16:47,810 hidden in the dark but it isn't very 380 00:16:49,940 --> 00:16:49,680 synchronistic with what we're talking 381 00:16:52,100 --> 00:16:49,950 about 382 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:52,110 it's perfect it's perfect it was the 383 00:16:56,540 --> 00:16:53,970 lure of the owl and the mythology of the 384 00:17:01,640 --> 00:16:56,550 owl I'm at the point now where I'm 385 00:17:04,069 --> 00:17:01,650 looking at reality the same way like 386 00:17:06,530 --> 00:17:04,079 like a like a gypsy fortune-teller would 387 00:17:09,079 --> 00:17:06,540 would do a dream analysis right so I'm 388 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:09,089 looking at these events in reality with 389 00:17:13,939 --> 00:17:11,490 the same even trying to pick out the 390 00:17:16,550 --> 00:17:13,949 mythic symbolism of real-life events in 391 00:17:18,199 --> 00:17:16,560 the same way that a dream analysis would 392 00:17:21,350 --> 00:17:18,209 would or you know someone doing a dream 393 00:17:22,939 --> 00:17:21,360 analysis would would pick out things so 394 00:17:25,699 --> 00:17:22,949 yes so these kind of synchronicities and 395 00:17:29,570 --> 00:17:25,709 these kind of mythic metaphors and stuff 396 00:17:33,020 --> 00:17:29,580 like that are I've just become lost in 397 00:17:35,390 --> 00:17:33,030 it immersed in it that's really wild and 398 00:17:39,380 --> 00:17:35,400 I wonder really how many people out 399 00:17:41,960 --> 00:17:39,390 there have had our experiences but just 400 00:17:44,300 --> 00:17:41,970 sort of didn't think much about it and 401 00:17:46,490 --> 00:17:44,310 unless you know you you direct them to 402 00:17:50,180 --> 00:17:46,500 it and that's sort of what happened to 403 00:17:52,390 --> 00:17:50,190 me I I remembered I think you asked me 404 00:17:54,910 --> 00:17:52,400 on Facebook you know when we were 405 00:17:57,800 --> 00:17:54,920 arranging to be on the show this evening 406 00:17:59,840 --> 00:17:57,810 you said if you had a now experience and 407 00:18:03,700 --> 00:17:59,850 I said no not really and then I rattled 408 00:18:07,130 --> 00:18:03,710 up a few things my mother collected owls 409 00:18:09,740 --> 00:18:07,140 there was a man who was mentally ill 410 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:09,750 that lived next door to us when I was a 411 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:12,450 little girl and he used to walk around 412 00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:15,450 his yard with an owl on his shoulder in 413 00:18:22,610 --> 00:18:18,110 a real a real owl 414 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:22,620 it was very very spooky and so those 415 00:18:28,370 --> 00:18:25,170 were sort of the owl things and so I 416 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:28,380 called my mom tonight before the show 417 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:30,090 and I said mom you know why did you 418 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:32,970 collect all those owls she said I don't 419 00:18:39,110 --> 00:18:36,690 know she said I just liked them and I 420 00:18:41,510 --> 00:18:39,120 just I mean she had tons of them all 421 00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:41,520 over the house and I dunno too and but 422 00:18:45,290 --> 00:18:42,480 that's what happens when you write a 423 00:18:48,890 --> 00:18:45,300 book about all those people's stuff like 424 00:18:50,930 --> 00:18:48,900 very understandable but I said why did 425 00:18:54,830 --> 00:18:50,940 she do it she said she didn't know but 426 00:18:57,169 --> 00:18:54,840 she she told me a story about 427 00:19:03,680 --> 00:18:57,179 when my grandfather died and that was 428 00:19:06,950 --> 00:19:03,690 back in I think around 1972 and my 429 00:19:10,659 --> 00:19:06,960 grandparents lived next door to a family 430 00:19:15,919 --> 00:19:10,669 in they were of Choctaw and Chickasaw 431 00:19:17,509 --> 00:19:15,929 Indian heritage and the night that my 432 00:19:19,460 --> 00:19:17,519 grandfather died and he was in the 433 00:19:22,610 --> 00:19:19,470 hospital when he died so he wasn't at 434 00:19:26,269 --> 00:19:22,620 the house but there their last name was 435 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:26,279 Billy the Billy's came over and to see 436 00:19:31,940 --> 00:19:29,090 my grandmother who was house bound 437 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:31,950 because they said they knew that my 438 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:33,690 grandfather had died because there had 439 00:19:38,779 --> 00:19:36,090 been an owl sitting on the pole outside 440 00:19:43,249 --> 00:19:38,789 their house all night so they came over 441 00:19:45,259 --> 00:19:43,259 without having been told so that was 442 00:19:49,700 --> 00:19:45,269 really interesting and I know in the 443 00:19:51,739 --> 00:19:49,710 book you know you covered that a lot but 444 00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:51,749 that I I said what was that when you 445 00:19:55,549 --> 00:19:54,090 started collecting Alice know and then 446 00:19:57,859 --> 00:19:55,559 she said oh there was something else she 447 00:20:02,350 --> 00:19:57,869 said when you had Joe Lee who was my 448 00:20:07,039 --> 00:20:02,360 daughter who passed away 12 years ago 449 00:20:10,129 --> 00:20:07,049 that my mother was at home sick in bed 450 00:20:13,700 --> 00:20:10,139 with the flu so my dad drove over I was 451 00:20:17,109 --> 00:20:13,710 living about a hundred miles from them 452 00:20:20,419 --> 00:20:17,119 my dad drove over to see me and the baby 453 00:20:23,779 --> 00:20:20,429 in the hospital and she said on the way 454 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:23,789 back he stopped at a jewelry store and 455 00:20:29,210 --> 00:20:27,330 he bought this pin which she still has 456 00:20:33,049 --> 00:20:29,220 she got it out while we were talking on 457 00:20:35,690 --> 00:20:33,059 the phone and it's a little owl with two 458 00:20:38,659 --> 00:20:35,700 rubies four eyes it's gold and it has 459 00:20:41,499 --> 00:20:38,669 two two rubies four eyes just you know I 460 00:20:44,239 --> 00:20:41,509 don't know why he bought me an owl and 461 00:20:46,100 --> 00:20:44,249 at some point later it's when she 462 00:20:47,899 --> 00:20:46,110 started collecting else and now I have a 463 00:20:49,549 --> 00:20:47,909 nice tits collecting Alice and I said 464 00:20:52,220 --> 00:20:49,559 did she collected house because you 465 00:20:54,289 --> 00:20:52,230 didn't she said no she said I stopped 466 00:20:55,039 --> 00:20:54,299 collecting those owls long before she 467 00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:55,049 was born 468 00:20:59,149 --> 00:20:57,090 so there's definitely an al connection 469 00:21:01,220 --> 00:20:59,159 going on in my family and what I said to 470 00:21:05,899 --> 00:21:01,230 you on on the post on Facebook today was 471 00:21:07,940 --> 00:21:05,909 I think we maybe maybe people oh yes and 472 00:21:08,549 --> 00:21:07,950 that's a term I use in the in the book 473 00:21:11,310 --> 00:21:08,559 and I just 474 00:21:14,239 --> 00:21:11,320 and what it would what I had to I had to 475 00:21:17,749 --> 00:21:14,249 I had to come up with some term because 476 00:21:20,700 --> 00:21:17,759 you know abduction has such a heavy 477 00:21:23,279 --> 00:21:20,710 burden in our culture I guess it's a 478 00:21:26,039 --> 00:21:23,289 very heavily weighted word you know UFO 479 00:21:28,230 --> 00:21:26,049 abduction and and it has sort of a 480 00:21:29,850 --> 00:21:28,240 definition and what I'm talking and I 481 00:21:31,619 --> 00:21:29,860 talk to people and they say well you 482 00:21:33,869 --> 00:21:31,629 know I saw UFO and I saw this owl here's 483 00:21:35,690 --> 00:21:33,879 our like the totally classic normal this 484 00:21:40,320 --> 00:21:35,700 is like up this so many times and 485 00:21:41,759 --> 00:21:40,330 somebody's you know in the woods they 486 00:21:43,950 --> 00:21:41,769 look up at a tree and there's the big 487 00:21:46,289 --> 00:21:43,960 owl and they'll say wow and oftentimes 488 00:21:48,869 --> 00:21:46,299 it was very common even if even without 489 00:21:51,330 --> 00:21:48,879 any paranormal stuff they'll say like 490 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:51,340 this really ominous very ominous bird 491 00:21:57,690 --> 00:21:53,610 it's got a very and I also have a heavy 492 00:21:59,460 --> 00:21:57,700 vibe to them all flies off the next 493 00:22:04,259 --> 00:21:59,470 thing that happens is if you know of a 494 00:22:07,590 --> 00:22:04,269 UFO flies above them within seconds and 495 00:22:08,850 --> 00:22:07,600 this I've got this a bunch and so you 496 00:22:10,409 --> 00:22:08,860 know you talk to these people and then 497 00:22:13,039 --> 00:22:10,419 they they say things like well I've had 498 00:22:15,509 --> 00:22:13,049 these odd dreams and I've had you know 499 00:22:17,249 --> 00:22:15,519 marks in my body and so they you know 500 00:22:20,190 --> 00:22:17,259 missing time they'll say things that a 501 00:22:23,100 --> 00:22:20,200 UFO abductees say but I'm not in any 502 00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:23,110 kind of position to you know talk to 503 00:22:26,970 --> 00:22:25,570 someone on the phone and and make that 504 00:22:28,859 --> 00:22:26,980 leap you know what I mean it's like I 505 00:22:30,810 --> 00:22:28,869 can't sort of declare someone's that you 506 00:22:33,149 --> 00:22:30,820 know so that's a very personal thing so 507 00:22:35,669 --> 00:22:33,159 these may be people that's a term that I 508 00:22:39,779 --> 00:22:35,679 use throughout the book is that you know 509 00:22:42,239 --> 00:22:39,789 these people are having owl experiences 510 00:22:45,090 --> 00:22:42,249 they're having many of the peripheral 511 00:22:47,549 --> 00:22:45,100 type of experiences that are sometimes 512 00:22:50,129 --> 00:22:47,559 reported by people who have had UFO 513 00:22:53,039 --> 00:22:50,139 contact or UFO abduction experiences and 514 00:22:55,830 --> 00:22:53,049 so I just you know I I just that's a 515 00:22:57,989 --> 00:22:55,840 that's a term I use in my sense is that 516 00:23:01,200 --> 00:22:57,999 a great number of these maybe people are 517 00:23:04,409 --> 00:23:01,210 quite probably have had UFO contact but 518 00:23:08,070 --> 00:23:04,419 it's it's just it's just a softer touch 519 00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:08,080 as far as how to address this that that 520 00:23:14,279 --> 00:23:11,610 term was so much baggage yes yeah I 521 00:23:17,279 --> 00:23:14,289 mentioned there's a lot of people like 522 00:23:20,490 --> 00:23:17,289 that that are having these sort of 523 00:23:22,210 --> 00:23:20,500 unusual things happening but they may 524 00:23:27,430 --> 00:23:22,220 not be connecting 525 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:27,440 or sort of looking beyond the surface or 526 00:23:31,810 --> 00:23:29,570 you know some people may not want to 527 00:23:34,210 --> 00:23:31,820 look beyond the surface I would think 528 00:23:35,980 --> 00:23:34,220 some people might not be ready I agree 529 00:23:37,210 --> 00:23:35,990 yeah it's very known that I've talked to 530 00:23:39,100 --> 00:23:37,220 a lot of people like that they'll tell 531 00:23:41,470 --> 00:23:39,110 me these things and they'll like they're 532 00:23:42,850 --> 00:23:41,480 not gonna go there you know and and and 533 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:42,860 you know oftentimes I'm doing this kind 534 00:23:45,100 --> 00:23:43,610 of research and you've probably 535 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:45,110 recognized this do you talk to someone 536 00:23:49,330 --> 00:23:46,970 for an hour or so and you get like the 537 00:23:50,529 --> 00:23:49,340 surface story and then you you know set 538 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:50,539 up another phone call or you meet with 539 00:23:54,130 --> 00:23:51,650 them again and they tell you a little 540 00:23:56,740 --> 00:23:54,140 more and then you know a long about you 541 00:23:58,450 --> 00:23:56,750 know usually it's about the fourth hour 542 00:24:01,330 --> 00:23:58,460 fourth or fifth hour where you talk with 543 00:24:03,310 --> 00:24:01,340 them then they start really sharing the 544 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:03,320 weird stuff and that weird stuff is so 545 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:09,530 strange and it's it's uh it it makes 546 00:24:13,659 --> 00:24:11,690 like it should be right you collect more 547 00:24:15,850 --> 00:24:13,669 data you collect more stories you 548 00:24:18,279 --> 00:24:15,860 collect more information you should have 549 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:18,289 clearer answers it should be leading you 550 00:24:23,919 --> 00:24:19,850 somewhere but it doesn't it it just gets 551 00:24:24,940 --> 00:24:23,929 more mind-boggling in a way and and so 552 00:24:28,120 --> 00:24:24,950 yeah that's kind of where I'm at right 553 00:24:29,740 --> 00:24:28,130 now there's there's there's uh I'm still 554 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:29,750 just as fascinated by this and what's 555 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:31,970 happening now is them getting since the 556 00:24:35,500 --> 00:24:34,010 book is out and if you if anyone has had 557 00:24:39,130 --> 00:24:35,510 an owl experience anywhere in the world 558 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:39,140 right it's it's a new era everyone's got 559 00:24:43,180 --> 00:24:41,450 a everyone's got a phone or they can you 560 00:24:45,580 --> 00:24:43,190 know come I'm a couple mouse clicks away 561 00:24:47,710 --> 00:24:45,590 if you google UFOs owls 562 00:24:49,810 --> 00:24:47,720 my name is the first thing that comes up 563 00:24:51,669 --> 00:24:49,820 and then it's probably the next 10 564 00:24:53,110 --> 00:24:51,679 things that come up under that so if 565 00:24:54,490 --> 00:24:53,120 anyone's had these experiences they're 566 00:24:56,529 --> 00:24:54,500 gonna find me and they reach out to me 567 00:24:58,510 --> 00:24:56,539 and I'm just gettin collecting so many 568 00:25:01,570 --> 00:24:58,520 stories that it's no longer a question 569 00:25:03,460 --> 00:25:01,580 of are these related I'm it's I'm 570 00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:03,470 assured that they're related by email 571 00:25:10,630 --> 00:25:06,770 INBOX is is enough proof for me what it 572 00:25:13,330 --> 00:25:10,640 might mean I'm I'm still at a loss for 573 00:25:15,730 --> 00:25:13,340 that that's that's really well do you 574 00:25:18,120 --> 00:25:15,740 know it I wonder if it's just something 575 00:25:21,310 --> 00:25:18,130 to draw your attention to something 576 00:25:22,289 --> 00:25:21,320 possibly you know it's like when you see 577 00:25:26,110 --> 00:25:22,299 the owls 578 00:25:27,220 --> 00:25:26,120 maybe it's pay attention exactly I say 579 00:25:29,710 --> 00:25:27,230 that in the book you know that's like 580 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:29,720 well you know like if people ask me like 581 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:30,890 what does this mean maybe that's where I 582 00:25:35,740 --> 00:25:32,330 heard that gee I thought I had an 583 00:25:36,100 --> 00:25:35,750 original thought ya know it's in there 584 00:25:37,539 --> 00:25:36,110 oh it's 585 00:25:41,740 --> 00:25:37,549 in there I say pay attention is like 586 00:25:43,630 --> 00:25:41,750 that's it that's a very key you know 587 00:25:47,730 --> 00:25:43,640 kind of message from the owl and the 588 00:25:50,500 --> 00:25:47,740 other one would be you know that they're 589 00:25:52,030 --> 00:25:50,510 an alarm clock in a way because that's 590 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:52,040 what the owl was for me it was an alarm 591 00:25:58,330 --> 00:25:55,850 clock like I was asleep I had these UFO 592 00:26:01,060 --> 00:25:58,340 experiences tucked away in my life I 593 00:26:04,539 --> 00:26:01,070 wasn't gonna deal with them all showed 594 00:26:07,120 --> 00:26:04,549 up it was like the clanging wind up loud 595 00:26:09,430 --> 00:26:07,130 electric ain't allowed you know clanging 596 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:09,440 Bell on an old-style alarm clock it was 597 00:26:15,789 --> 00:26:11,330 annoying and it was persistent and it 598 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:15,799 forced me to look into these to my own 599 00:26:24,220 --> 00:26:19,010 experiences well I I know you get into 600 00:26:28,270 --> 00:26:24,230 you know symbolism and archetypes in in 601 00:26:30,100 --> 00:26:28,280 the book and it does seem like that you 602 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:30,110 know there's our symbolism everywhere 603 00:26:36,039 --> 00:26:32,690 you look you know in in ancient times 604 00:26:39,730 --> 00:26:36,049 and in ancient cultures and all the way 605 00:26:42,789 --> 00:26:39,740 up through and around the world it seems 606 00:26:45,610 --> 00:26:42,799 that you know I'll symbolize certain 607 00:26:47,590 --> 00:26:45,620 things to certain cultures but it seems 608 00:26:51,030 --> 00:26:47,600 like you know you hear the you hear the 609 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:51,040 term the wise old owl it seems to 610 00:26:57,549 --> 00:26:54,530 signify wisdom it's associated with the 611 00:27:01,900 --> 00:26:57,559 goddess Athena that had the owl on her 612 00:27:04,510 --> 00:27:01,910 shoulder and in in because of that I 613 00:27:07,990 --> 00:27:04,520 think the Greeks kind of associated with 614 00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:08,000 AB eminent aspect George anything at 615 00:27:12,730 --> 00:27:10,250 night time is generally feminine that's 616 00:27:15,130 --> 00:27:12,740 right and the daylight is you know so 617 00:27:17,860 --> 00:27:15,140 Zeus had an eagle and an Athena had an 618 00:27:19,780 --> 00:27:17,870 owl and you know the eagle is a symbol 619 00:27:23,010 --> 00:27:19,790 of the day and strength and masculinity 620 00:27:26,740 --> 00:27:23,020 and and ego and the owl is a symbol of 621 00:27:29,770 --> 00:27:26,750 looking inward and femininity and and it 622 00:27:32,500 --> 00:27:29,780 says so yes so there's a sort of mystery 623 00:27:36,580 --> 00:27:32,510 and magic mystery and magic yeah and and 624 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:36,590 that um you know if an owl shows up and 625 00:27:41,140 --> 00:27:39,890 this is this is kind of I didn't really 626 00:27:42,850 --> 00:27:41,150 cover this so much in the book but this 627 00:27:44,230 --> 00:27:42,860 has happened since the book has come out 628 00:27:48,220 --> 00:27:44,240 and since I've collected so many more 629 00:27:49,990 --> 00:27:48,230 stories like an owl is not an easy totem 630 00:27:52,150 --> 00:27:50,000 right if someone get 631 00:27:53,770 --> 00:27:52,160 like if if you've got an owl showing up 632 00:27:55,510 --> 00:27:53,780 right so I'm just I just you know I'm 633 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:55,520 taking I'm not wearing my UFO 634 00:28:04,600 --> 00:27:57,050 investigator hat right now I'm sort of 635 00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:04,610 wearing my shaman hat and I I think that 636 00:28:11,340 --> 00:28:08,290 the if an owl shows up it is a hard 637 00:28:13,650 --> 00:28:11,350 message you're you're confronted with a 638 00:28:16,510 --> 00:28:13,660 challenging message doesn't make it bad 639 00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:16,520 but it but you often are confronted with 640 00:28:26,170 --> 00:28:21,110 like doing some deep inner work let's 641 00:28:28,510 --> 00:28:26,180 say mmm so it's like a heavy message a 642 00:28:29,680 --> 00:28:28,520 deep message it's not a light message I 643 00:28:31,660 --> 00:28:29,690 mean there's some messengers you know 644 00:28:33,580 --> 00:28:31,670 hummingbirds are considered very light 645 00:28:36,460 --> 00:28:33,590 and very playful and in like a lot of 646 00:28:40,390 --> 00:28:36,470 cultures as far as their message 647 00:28:42,340 --> 00:28:40,400 owls are not you know and it's also a 648 00:28:43,750 --> 00:28:42,350 message of the transformational process 649 00:28:47,470 --> 00:28:43,760 this is something I did talk about in 650 00:28:49,420 --> 00:28:47,480 the book where you know what can you 651 00:28:51,940 --> 00:28:49,430 hold that thought drink because we got 652 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:51,950 to take a quick break and I don't want 653 00:28:56,290 --> 00:28:53,450 you to get started and then you have to 654 00:28:57,820 --> 00:28:56,300 restart so we'll take that up as soon as 655 00:28:59,560 --> 00:28:57,830 we get back so I hope you'll hang in 656 00:29:04,300 --> 00:28:59,570 there with us and we'll be right back 657 00:29:06,340 --> 00:29:04,310 with Mike Cleland welcome back to night 658 00:29:08,500 --> 00:29:06,350 vision if you're just joining us we're 659 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:08,510 talking with Mike Cleland he's the 660 00:29:14,950 --> 00:29:11,530 author of the messengers owls 661 00:29:16,870 --> 00:29:14,960 synchronicity and the UFO abductees and 662 00:29:18,460 --> 00:29:16,880 there's really a lot more you just 663 00:29:21,670 --> 00:29:18,470 couldn't possibly have that long of a 664 00:29:24,340 --> 00:29:21,680 title but it's amazing you know when you 665 00:29:28,210 --> 00:29:24,350 really start thinking about it how Al's 666 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:28,220 are so prominent in so many cultures and 667 00:29:32,860 --> 00:29:31,250 how many people have our experiences we 668 00:29:34,210 --> 00:29:32,870 were talking too quickly off the air and 669 00:29:35,890 --> 00:29:34,220 I know you were making a point or 670 00:29:37,300 --> 00:29:35,900 getting ready to when we when we went 671 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:37,310 off the air and I want to let you do 672 00:29:42,910 --> 00:29:40,130 that but about how many people you know 673 00:29:45,070 --> 00:29:42,920 contact you constantly and I'm just 674 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:45,080 wondering if someone in our listening 675 00:29:50,530 --> 00:29:47,810 audience would like to contact you to 676 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:50,540 talk about their own owl experience how 677 00:29:55,690 --> 00:29:52,490 do how do they find you they google you 678 00:29:58,419 --> 00:29:55,700 they google owls UFOs and what is your 679 00:29:59,590 --> 00:29:58,429 your blog address I should have had it 680 00:30:01,350 --> 00:29:59,600 right in front of me and I don't oh I 681 00:30:02,980 --> 00:30:01,360 can do that easy enough yes so it's a 682 00:30:12,730 --> 00:30:02,990 experience 683 00:30:14,529 --> 00:30:12,740 owls and it'll come right up and there's 684 00:30:17,470 --> 00:30:14,539 my contact information is easy to find 685 00:30:20,919 --> 00:30:17,480 on the blog and yet just so just send me 686 00:30:23,139 --> 00:30:20,929 an email and and I'll do my best to get 687 00:30:26,169 --> 00:30:23,149 back I apologize like sometimes people I 688 00:30:29,350 --> 00:30:26,179 just I get a lot of people contacting me 689 00:30:30,820 --> 00:30:29,360 and I I try to get back to everyone and 690 00:30:33,159 --> 00:30:30,830 I apologize because sometimes it's just 691 00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:33,169 I just feel I'm overloaded but um I do 692 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:33,770 the best I can 693 00:30:38,799 --> 00:30:36,890 oh yeah it's it's amazing that you know 694 00:30:40,659 --> 00:30:38,809 there are that many people out there and 695 00:30:43,090 --> 00:30:40,669 just imagine if you're getting if you're 696 00:30:45,370 --> 00:30:43,100 hearing from that many how many more 697 00:30:48,070 --> 00:30:45,380 there are that you know that you're not 698 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:48,080 hearing from yet so it's it's really 699 00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:50,570 wild I I remember I did something 700 00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:52,730 similar I didn't write a book about it I 701 00:31:00,419 --> 00:30:55,730 guess I'm too lazy for that but I did I 702 00:31:03,159 --> 00:31:00,429 sort of had a little mini obsession with 703 00:31:05,799 --> 00:31:03,169 asking people and as I was talking to 704 00:31:09,180 --> 00:31:05,809 you on the break Mike was involved with 705 00:31:13,450 --> 00:31:09,190 a UFO research group here in Los Angeles 706 00:31:17,380 --> 00:31:13,460 we were it was a research and support 707 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:17,390 group for UFO abductees people who felt 708 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:20,690 they'd had that experience and we had a 709 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:28,330 lot of owl experiences in that time but 710 00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:32,090 mmus it was an amazing thing you know I 711 00:31:36,580 --> 00:31:34,250 thought it was synchronous to get it you 712 00:31:38,799 --> 00:31:36,590 know that you see well or an apropos 713 00:31:41,230 --> 00:31:38,809 title I guess would be more like it your 714 00:31:42,789 --> 00:31:41,240 blog spot is hidden experiences because 715 00:31:44,889 --> 00:31:42,799 that's really what we're talking about 716 00:31:47,889 --> 00:31:44,899 and that's what all of those people that 717 00:31:52,750 --> 00:31:47,899 would come to those meetings you know 718 00:31:54,399 --> 00:31:52,760 spoke about it you know some people if 719 00:31:56,049 --> 00:31:54,409 you have a Lowe's advantage card you can 720 00:31:58,060 --> 00:31:56,059 get an extra five percent off every day 721 00:31:59,440 --> 00:31:58,070 on items big or small so you can save an 722 00:32:01,539 --> 00:31:59,450 extra five percent on a new coat of 723 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:01,549 paint updating appliances replacing the 724 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:03,770 flooring and even save an extra 5% on 725 00:32:06,990 --> 00:32:05,210 little things like cleaning supplies 726 00:32:08,669 --> 00:32:07,000 laundry detergent and air filters 727 00:32:11,039 --> 00:32:08,679 the big two dues to the everyday 728 00:32:12,570 --> 00:32:11,049 essentials you get an extra 5% savings 729 00:32:14,669 --> 00:32:12,580 every day when you use your Lowe's 730 00:32:16,860 --> 00:32:14,679 advantage card you don't have one apply 731 00:32:18,570 --> 00:32:16,870 today all projects have a starting point 732 00:32:19,710 --> 00:32:18,580 start with Lowe's subjective credit 733 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:19,720 approval and can't be combined with any 734 00:32:22,919 --> 00:32:21,250 other credit offers exclusions apply see 735 00:32:25,830 --> 00:32:22,929 store for details us only want to keep 736 00:32:27,500 --> 00:32:25,840 them hidden and others are just trying 737 00:32:30,270 --> 00:32:27,510 to figure out what the heck is going on 738 00:32:32,070 --> 00:32:30,280 yeah that's gin it's a genuine mystery 739 00:32:33,570 --> 00:32:32,080 yeah it's a genuine mystery and it--and 740 00:32:35,490 --> 00:32:33,580 that that's funny cuz when you start a 741 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:35,500 blog this is you know this is quite this 742 00:32:39,870 --> 00:32:37,530 is 2009 when I started this thing and oh 743 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:39,880 you know you just it's like a little you 744 00:32:43,529 --> 00:32:42,010 just there's this if you fill in these 745 00:32:44,399 --> 00:32:43,539 little boxes right you know this little 746 00:32:46,770 --> 00:32:44,409 thing like what do you want to name your 747 00:32:47,940 --> 00:32:46,780 blog I had no idea I call this one like 748 00:32:50,940 --> 00:32:47,950 oh I got a name the thing and I'm like 749 00:32:53,789 --> 00:32:50,950 uh I just take that in and I just moved 750 00:32:56,220 --> 00:32:53,799 on and it's really been very very 751 00:32:59,700 --> 00:32:56,230 appropriate and and yes oh I agree that 752 00:33:04,110 --> 00:32:59,710 this there's something hidden that we 753 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:04,120 may never know that's that's you know 754 00:33:10,169 --> 00:33:07,330 that's at the core of this mystery and I 755 00:33:12,810 --> 00:33:10,179 was talking before that the how the owls 756 00:33:14,130 --> 00:33:12,820 in my opinion or the I talked about it 757 00:33:16,350 --> 00:33:14,140 at length in the book there's a 758 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:16,360 transform they're like the totem animal 759 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:18,850 of the transformational process so and 760 00:33:23,340 --> 00:33:20,770 there's you know so it doesn't just mean 761 00:33:24,930 --> 00:33:23,350 UFO contact which could certainly be 762 00:33:27,409 --> 00:33:24,940 transformative to the to the person 763 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:27,419 enduring that are bearing up under that 764 00:33:32,340 --> 00:33:30,850 it could it means you know meditation 765 00:33:34,289 --> 00:33:32,350 I've got a lot of stories about people 766 00:33:35,279 --> 00:33:34,299 meditating you know there's one 767 00:33:38,490 --> 00:33:35,289 beautiful story 768 00:33:41,549 --> 00:33:38,500 this guy he's french-canadian so it's he 769 00:33:43,289 --> 00:33:41,559 said he was standing in a field and he 770 00:33:46,620 --> 00:33:43,299 likes to meditate outside and he said 771 00:33:49,140 --> 00:33:46,630 like I he spits like a message to God 772 00:33:52,529 --> 00:33:49,150 thank God I want to work for the 773 00:33:54,990 --> 00:33:52,539 upliftment of mankind I want to work for 774 00:33:56,940 --> 00:33:55,000 the upliftment of humankind and he sat 775 00:33:59,520 --> 00:33:56,950 down and meditated and when he opened 776 00:34:02,520 --> 00:33:59,530 his eyes there was a there was a snowy 777 00:34:04,919 --> 00:34:02,530 owl right in his line of sight you know 778 00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:04,929 sitting on the ground and he got some 779 00:34:08,129 --> 00:34:06,370 beautiful pictures and sent them to me 780 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:08,139 and it eventually flew off and this is I 781 00:34:13,470 --> 00:34:10,210 mean that's so he's basically saying 782 00:34:16,079 --> 00:34:13,480 dear God I want to help the world I want 783 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:16,089 to uplift the world and then he seizes 784 00:34:25,350 --> 00:34:22,530 on its own that's easy to dismiss but I 785 00:34:29,460 --> 00:34:25,360 have so many accounts like that 786 00:34:31,860 --> 00:34:29,470 so not only meditation um shamanic 787 00:34:33,510 --> 00:34:31,870 initiation it's very common 788 00:34:35,820 --> 00:34:33,520 someone goes through the it's shamanic 789 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:35,830 the process of being initiated to be a 790 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:40,810 shaman and they see owls I will show up 791 00:34:45,330 --> 00:34:41,650 I will show up in their life 792 00:34:47,670 --> 00:34:45,340 synchronistically I'll show up this is 793 00:34:49,590 --> 00:34:47,680 this is considered normal when you talk 794 00:34:53,490 --> 00:34:49,600 to folks who are immersed in you know 795 00:34:55,770 --> 00:34:53,500 the synchronistic practices and I write 796 00:35:00,090 --> 00:34:55,780 extensively about shamanism in the book 797 00:35:01,860 --> 00:35:00,100 and then mushrooms people say I'm sure 798 00:35:04,380 --> 00:35:01,870 other psychedelic drugs - but mushrooms 799 00:35:07,800 --> 00:35:04,390 in particular people see owls and and 800 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:07,810 have owl experiences so these and then 801 00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:09,850 you know there's a whole chapter on 802 00:35:15,750 --> 00:35:13,210 death so and there's you know that's the 803 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:15,760 ultimate transformation right there 804 00:35:21,570 --> 00:35:18,010 death and one of the things that happens 805 00:35:22,980 --> 00:35:21,580 and and as and I collected a bunch of 806 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:22,990 stories and I retell a bunch and I've 807 00:35:28,650 --> 00:35:26,610 since heard more of them is that people 808 00:35:30,390 --> 00:35:28,660 there's a couple stories that are so 809 00:35:34,550 --> 00:35:30,400 complicated and take so long to tell but 810 00:35:38,190 --> 00:35:34,560 I'll just boil it down so a woman her 811 00:35:40,680 --> 00:35:38,200 her mother dies and she's mourning and 812 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:40,690 she talks to a friend and she says 813 00:35:44,580 --> 00:35:42,490 listen I'm just I can't mom's too gone 814 00:35:46,530 --> 00:35:44,590 I'm totally depressed I can't I just I 815 00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:46,540 just need to sign and a woman her friend 816 00:35:50,250 --> 00:35:48,370 said like just wait you know this the 817 00:35:52,260 --> 00:35:50,260 sign wall you know the sign will show up 818 00:35:53,580 --> 00:35:52,270 when it needs to in the next morning she 819 00:35:55,470 --> 00:35:53,590 gets up and she goes into her garage and 820 00:35:56,910 --> 00:35:55,480 she was on a shelf and and it's 821 00:35:58,950 --> 00:35:56,920 interesting cuz she said every shelf in 822 00:36:00,300 --> 00:35:58,960 the garage was her husband's he had kept 823 00:36:03,300 --> 00:36:00,310 all his stuff in the garage she only was 824 00:36:05,760 --> 00:36:03,310 had one shelf this is how old was on her 825 00:36:07,650 --> 00:36:05,770 shelf his little owl in the in the 826 00:36:12,240 --> 00:36:07,660 garage was like closed how did I'll get 827 00:36:14,100 --> 00:36:12,250 in live owl a live owl in her garage 828 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:14,110 sitting there she's got pictures of it 829 00:36:18,450 --> 00:36:16,810 that's in the book and and she she gets 830 00:36:20,580 --> 00:36:18,460 down there cell phone and she calls her 831 00:36:22,950 --> 00:36:20,590 cousin this is where I heard this story 832 00:36:26,190 --> 00:36:22,960 from from her cousin and his name is lon 833 00:36:30,330 --> 00:36:26,200 he is he also had a bunch of owl 834 00:36:35,340 --> 00:36:32,460 and she's like talking on the phone like 835 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:35,350 like to the owl as if it's her mom it's 836 00:36:39,930 --> 00:36:37,810 like mom daddy's on the phone I'm 837 00:36:41,970 --> 00:36:39,940 talking to Lonnie right now and she's 838 00:36:43,470 --> 00:36:41,980 and and this goes on all day and then 839 00:36:45,150 --> 00:36:43,480 she goes out it's Thanksgiving Day this 840 00:36:50,370 --> 00:36:45,160 happened on Thanksgiving Day she goes 841 00:36:52,020 --> 00:36:50,380 out and she comes back and that was 842 00:36:52,580 --> 00:36:52,030 still in the garage after Thanksgiving 843 00:36:56,070 --> 00:36:52,590 dinner 844 00:36:57,780 --> 00:36:56,080 and she says mom mom I got it I got the 845 00:36:59,130 --> 00:36:57,790 message you can go now thank you thank 846 00:37:00,930 --> 00:36:59,140 you so much I miss you 847 00:37:02,550 --> 00:37:00,940 it's so wonderful you can't she talks to 848 00:37:06,450 --> 00:37:02,560 the owl as if it's her mom and they all 849 00:37:08,070 --> 00:37:06,460 flies off now that talking to the owl as 850 00:37:13,020 --> 00:37:08,080 if it's a dead loved one usually a 851 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:13,030 parent is so common and that sub really 852 00:37:18,390 --> 00:37:14,050 surprised me because these are like 853 00:37:19,830 --> 00:37:18,400 grounded you know not you know very 854 00:37:25,860 --> 00:37:19,840 grounded people that are telling me 855 00:37:28,650 --> 00:37:25,870 these stories now yes so and then and 856 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:28,660 then UFO contact would be its own form 857 00:37:35,510 --> 00:37:32,050 of transformational experience so so in 858 00:37:39,060 --> 00:37:35,520 a way you know the owl would represent 859 00:37:40,710 --> 00:37:39,070 you know a transformation you know my 860 00:37:42,420 --> 00:37:40,720 sense would be a deeper transformation 861 00:37:48,260 --> 00:37:42,430 you know so digging deeper you know sort 862 00:37:52,590 --> 00:37:48,270 of like a call to to go in deeper hmm 863 00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:52,600 absolutely I'm we've got an active chat 864 00:37:56,070 --> 00:37:53,890 room tonight if you're out there 865 00:37:57,900 --> 00:37:56,080 listening and you'd like to join in with 866 00:38:01,350 --> 00:37:57,910 the conversation they're talking about 867 00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:01,360 owls all kinds of strange experiences 868 00:38:09,210 --> 00:38:04,570 you can join them and me I'm on there 869 00:38:12,420 --> 00:38:09,220 too I are in chat calm I their 870 00:38:16,790 --> 00:38:12,430 mentioning mic the movie the Fourth Kind 871 00:38:19,980 --> 00:38:16,800 oh yes which I address so that so yeah 872 00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:19,990 as I said earlier I think that movie 873 00:38:31,620 --> 00:38:26,770 came out in 2009 I think yeah it's 2009 874 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:31,630 I think it came out so um I my sense is 875 00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:34,890 that the script writers of that of that 876 00:38:43,020 --> 00:38:39,450 film was purported to be a sort of a 877 00:38:44,710 --> 00:38:43,030 documentary you know it had like 878 00:38:46,990 --> 00:38:44,720 supposedly an archival 879 00:38:49,180 --> 00:38:47,000 footage from actual hypnotic regressions 880 00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:49,190 and things like that that's it was a it 881 00:38:53,020 --> 00:38:50,690 was that's a that was a publicity stunt 882 00:38:56,140 --> 00:38:53,030 and it's clever and I liked it and I can 883 00:38:58,050 --> 00:38:56,150 just you know I'm all for you know kind 884 00:39:00,640 --> 00:38:58,060 of low-budget horror movies you know 885 00:39:02,740 --> 00:39:00,650 that's great you know I've got that's 886 00:39:05,200 --> 00:39:02,750 off to him for little publicity stunts 887 00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:05,210 like that but anyway my sense is that 888 00:39:11,050 --> 00:39:09,170 they simply looked at the at the and you 889 00:39:13,060 --> 00:39:11,060 throw things yeah at the stories and 890 00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:13,070 then they recognize just as as I'm not 891 00:39:15,700 --> 00:39:14,330 the only one that recognized that I'm 892 00:39:17,650 --> 00:39:15,710 just the only one that wrote a 400 page 893 00:39:19,810 --> 00:39:17,660 book on it but that there's these owls 894 00:39:21,610 --> 00:39:19,820 are showing up in these reports and and 895 00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:21,620 and they're perfect right there the the 896 00:39:25,720 --> 00:39:23,570 stuff of haunted house movies owls are 897 00:39:26,950 --> 00:39:25,730 perfect and this is the someone's in the 898 00:39:28,330 --> 00:39:26,960 wood at night woods at night if you want 899 00:39:29,680 --> 00:39:28,340 to make it spooky all you have to do is 900 00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:29,690 have a hooting owl off in the distance 901 00:39:35,820 --> 00:39:31,610 in a movie and it you know it adds to 902 00:39:38,740 --> 00:39:35,830 that to that tenor of eeriness wow 903 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:38,750 that's that's really well you know I 904 00:39:45,930 --> 00:39:41,810 know in the book you mentioned that sort 905 00:39:50,740 --> 00:39:45,940 of where it came out in the sort of 906 00:39:53,350 --> 00:39:50,750 United States in the UFO world the first 907 00:39:55,630 --> 00:39:53,360 you know sort of references in 908 00:39:59,620 --> 00:39:55,640 publication came out in Whitley 909 00:40:02,500 --> 00:39:59,630 streamer's book communion and I was 910 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:02,510 thinking about you know what all the UFO 911 00:40:06,730 --> 00:40:04,490 abductees that you know I've spoken with 912 00:40:11,670 --> 00:40:06,740 and that I've read about that have had 913 00:40:16,620 --> 00:40:11,680 this sort of symbolism or or owl 914 00:40:19,570 --> 00:40:16,630 experiences and I was wondering about 915 00:40:21,820 --> 00:40:19,580 I'm sure and I know you're you've read 916 00:40:24,940 --> 00:40:21,830 everything on UFO experiences you must 917 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:24,950 have read interrupted journey the story 918 00:40:29,710 --> 00:40:26,690 of Betty and Barney Hill you know I 919 00:40:31,870 --> 00:40:29,720 never read that oh my goodness I've got 920 00:40:33,910 --> 00:40:31,880 to grab that book and go through it now 921 00:40:35,860 --> 00:40:33,920 and see if there's any mention of owls 922 00:40:37,690 --> 00:40:35,870 or anything but you know what I've been 923 00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:37,700 doing and this is funny this is I'll 924 00:40:44,830 --> 00:40:42,890 just I'll let you doing is is you know 925 00:40:47,770 --> 00:40:44,840 it's it's the modern age right so I can 926 00:40:49,270 --> 00:40:47,780 just get a book for you know ten dollars 927 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:49,280 usually is probably the price of a book 928 00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:51,290 you know and just get it and put it on 929 00:40:56,140 --> 00:40:53,810 my e-reader so I put it on my iPad and 930 00:40:58,370 --> 00:40:56,150 scan it and then you can in any way then 931 00:41:01,220 --> 00:40:58,380 you have ow yeah then you can search 932 00:41:02,810 --> 00:41:01,230 out the word owl yeah and and and so 933 00:41:04,370 --> 00:41:02,820 it's instant right so it doesn't may I 934 00:41:06,380 --> 00:41:04,380 hate don't have to go to a bookstore I 935 00:41:08,390 --> 00:41:06,390 don't have to like wait it happens 936 00:41:10,930 --> 00:41:08,400 within a few minutes I can look like and 937 00:41:13,940 --> 00:41:10,940 then search the book but what happens is 938 00:41:16,100 --> 00:41:13,950 so you look up the word owl in all kinds 939 00:41:18,770 --> 00:41:16,110 of other words show up slowly shows that 940 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:18,780 bol shows up but one of the words that 941 00:41:23,780 --> 00:41:21,570 shows up is knowledge so you you know 942 00:41:25,130 --> 00:41:23,790 and and it shows up you know often in 943 00:41:26,810 --> 00:41:25,140 these kind of books is sort of 944 00:41:29,210 --> 00:41:26,820 introspective books like this the word 945 00:41:31,970 --> 00:41:29,220 knowledge shows up often and so what I'm 946 00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:31,980 doing is I have to like swipe pass 947 00:41:35,690 --> 00:41:34,170 knowledge I've gotta go okay let's get 948 00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:35,700 past knowledge let's get past knowledge 949 00:41:41,330 --> 00:41:38,850 and in a way that has been my own 950 00:41:46,760 --> 00:41:41,340 journey it has been sort of to move 951 00:41:49,580 --> 00:41:46,770 beyond knowledge and and then follow 952 00:41:53,660 --> 00:41:49,590 something a little more elusive and a 953 00:41:57,590 --> 00:41:53,670 little deeper and and so in very plainly 954 00:42:00,890 --> 00:41:57,600 with the iPad in my hand I have to move 955 00:42:03,860 --> 00:42:00,900 beyond knowledge to get to the owl and 956 00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:03,870 that that just rang so true as far as 957 00:42:06,650 --> 00:42:05,010 that because I had to like really 958 00:42:09,020 --> 00:42:06,660 abandoned like Ike was like confronted 959 00:42:10,790 --> 00:42:09,030 with so much weird stuff and I just said 960 00:42:14,290 --> 00:42:10,800 listen I you know like I wanted to cling 961 00:42:19,010 --> 00:42:14,300 to some sort of like materialistic 962 00:42:20,750 --> 00:42:19,020 pragmatic clear thinking logical stuff 963 00:42:23,180 --> 00:42:20,760 and that's not what happened I had to 964 00:42:25,460 --> 00:42:23,190 abandon myself to the weird stuff to the 965 00:42:27,050 --> 00:42:25,470 to the outlying stuff to the stuff that 966 00:42:32,240 --> 00:42:27,060 didn't make any sense to the stuff that 967 00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:32,250 I I I should dismiss given what society 968 00:42:35,570 --> 00:42:34,050 tells me someone tells me a story that 969 00:42:38,210 --> 00:42:35,580 simply can't possibly simply can't be 970 00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:38,220 true and I have to dismiss it but I 971 00:42:42,620 --> 00:42:40,290 can't because I'm hearing it so 972 00:42:44,870 --> 00:42:42,630 consistently the same story over and 973 00:42:47,450 --> 00:42:44,880 over again that's interesting because 974 00:42:50,740 --> 00:42:47,460 you know I think you I think you 975 00:42:53,450 --> 00:42:50,750 probably mentioned in the book and 976 00:42:55,940 --> 00:42:53,460 certainly it's mentioned everywhere that 977 00:42:59,180 --> 00:42:55,950 owls you know sort of you see the little 978 00:43:02,750 --> 00:42:59,190 cartoons of the owls with the graduation 979 00:43:05,150 --> 00:43:02,760 gown and cap on and so that sort of you 980 00:43:07,990 --> 00:43:05,160 know representing knowledge but really I 981 00:43:10,790 --> 00:43:08,000 think the original reference was to 982 00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:10,800 wisdom and that there's a very big 983 00:43:15,970 --> 00:43:11,930 difference between 984 00:43:17,410 --> 00:43:15,980 wisdom and knowledge yes in in in sort 985 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:17,420 of a little like you know elementary 986 00:43:22,300 --> 00:43:19,490 school all the thing you know that yeah 987 00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:22,310 the the you know the wise owl is is the 988 00:43:30,010 --> 00:43:27,530 teacher often in and that goes right 989 00:43:31,450 --> 00:43:30,020 back to Athena who had Anna campaign in 990 00:43:32,710 --> 00:43:31,460 little owl she was the goddess of wisdom 991 00:43:34,180 --> 00:43:32,720 so that's where it comes from so right 992 00:43:35,590 --> 00:43:34,190 now little kids in elementary school 993 00:43:37,330 --> 00:43:35,600 when they when they you know graduate 994 00:43:39,970 --> 00:43:37,340 from kindergarten and move go to first 995 00:43:42,790 --> 00:43:39,980 grade their classroom is adorned with 996 00:43:48,070 --> 00:43:42,800 little owls this this is mythology 997 00:43:50,980 --> 00:43:48,080 that's 3000 years old then is so wild so 998 00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:50,990 here's in present-day right so here you 999 00:43:53,410 --> 00:43:52,130 know this is so there's some stuff 1000 00:43:55,450 --> 00:43:53,420 that's you know you can go into there's 1001 00:43:58,600 --> 00:43:55,460 K there's beautiful imagery of owls and 1002 00:44:00,460 --> 00:43:58,610 caves and so everyone recognize the 1003 00:44:02,980 --> 00:44:00,470 power of the owls and my sense is that 1004 00:44:05,110 --> 00:44:02,990 you know they these you know tribal cave 1005 00:44:07,090 --> 00:44:05,120 dwellers were probably having the same 1006 00:44:09,370 --> 00:44:07,100 type of experiences that people are 1007 00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:09,380 reporting to me owls associated with 1008 00:44:14,290 --> 00:44:11,330 death or with deep transformation or 1009 00:44:16,060 --> 00:44:14,300 inward journey and that's where the 1010 00:44:22,380 --> 00:44:16,070 that's where the mythologies grew out of 1011 00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:22,390 and now present day you know we have 1012 00:44:29,620 --> 00:44:26,210 Harry Potter and in the Harry Potter 1013 00:44:31,570 --> 00:44:29,630 books the owls deliver the mail which is 1014 00:44:34,210 --> 00:44:31,580 perfect there are the messengers it's 1015 00:44:35,770 --> 00:44:34,220 perfect it's ancient mythology just 1016 00:44:37,930 --> 00:44:35,780 plugged into the into the most popular 1017 00:44:38,950 --> 00:44:37,940 book that's ever you know been the 1018 00:44:41,500 --> 00:44:38,960 series of books that's ever been 1019 00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:41,510 published and I will also add that JK 1020 00:44:47,040 --> 00:44:43,490 Rowling if you spell her name out has 1021 00:44:49,150 --> 00:44:47,050 owl right in her name oh she does I 1022 00:44:50,980 --> 00:44:49,160 don't know what that means and I'm not 1023 00:44:54,090 --> 00:44:50,990 gonna like start a new religion on that 1024 00:44:58,260 --> 00:44:54,100 alone but I'd like to point out yeah 1025 00:45:00,490 --> 00:44:58,270 yeah it was like when I had my little 1026 00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:00,500 realization about night-vision radio 1027 00:45:05,230 --> 00:45:02,570 tonight as a night vision oh my gosh 1028 00:45:06,910 --> 00:45:05,240 owls yeah the same thing just before 1029 00:45:08,770 --> 00:45:06,920 just shortly before we went on the air I 1030 00:45:10,810 --> 00:45:08,780 was like that's interesting that is kind 1031 00:45:16,420 --> 00:45:10,820 of curious isn't that funny 1032 00:45:18,490 --> 00:45:16,430 yeah yeah now I know you told some 1033 00:45:20,530 --> 00:45:18,500 stories that you know that you got 1034 00:45:23,230 --> 00:45:20,540 first-hand accounts from other people 1035 00:45:25,720 --> 00:45:23,240 and first I wanted to ask you if you 1036 00:45:28,180 --> 00:45:25,730 felt like sharing any any more 1037 00:45:29,590 --> 00:45:28,190 your own I just pick whatever story you 1038 00:45:31,630 --> 00:45:29,600 want to tell because they're so 1039 00:45:33,940 --> 00:45:31,640 interesting and I think people would 1040 00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:33,950 sort of relate to some of these stories 1041 00:45:40,270 --> 00:45:36,050 and I bet they might trigger some 1042 00:45:43,390 --> 00:45:40,280 memories for people what's the most 1043 00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:43,400 interesting story you have I tell you 1044 00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:45,890 the one with Kristen in the woods with 1045 00:45:49,420 --> 00:45:47,570 the Alice that was a pretty that's gonna 1046 00:45:50,710 --> 00:45:49,430 be a pretty hard one to top but that 1047 00:45:53,470 --> 00:45:50,720 there's nothing that really happens 1048 00:45:55,870 --> 00:45:53,480 there's no UFOs right it's a UFO story 1049 00:45:58,420 --> 00:45:55,880 without any UFOs right so true that's 1050 00:45:59,710 --> 00:45:58,430 yeah so so here so here this is a couple 1051 00:46:02,380 --> 00:45:59,720 so why I was getting these stories 1052 00:46:03,250 --> 00:46:02,390 side-by-side I was getting a cold 1053 00:46:04,870 --> 00:46:03,260 there's a chapter in the book called 1054 00:46:06,700 --> 00:46:04,880 back-to-back stories I got a handful of 1055 00:46:08,170 --> 00:46:06,710 them and they were just remarkable and I 1056 00:46:11,470 --> 00:46:08,180 could some of them are alive we have us 1057 00:46:14,349 --> 00:46:11,480 some time salt just this is as a woman 1058 00:46:16,680 --> 00:46:14,359 named Susan her Susan Kornacki she gave 1059 00:46:21,550 --> 00:46:16,690 me permission to use her full name and 1060 00:46:23,170 --> 00:46:21,560 she she's very much open with her UFO 1061 00:46:25,180 --> 00:46:23,180 contact experiences she talks about it 1062 00:46:25,859 --> 00:46:25,190 publicly she talks about it on her you 1063 00:46:28,180 --> 00:46:25,869 know online 1064 00:46:29,620 --> 00:46:28,190 she's very public and open about it so 1065 00:46:34,330 --> 00:46:29,630 there's so I'm not letting anything out 1066 00:46:37,660 --> 00:46:34,340 of the bag she was at an Easter party 1067 00:46:39,910 --> 00:46:37,670 and Easter Sunday she was at an Easter 1068 00:46:44,859 --> 00:46:39,920 party and and she was with her husband 1069 00:46:46,090 --> 00:46:44,869 and their daughter and they've come in 1070 00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:46,100 separate cars for some reason I can't 1071 00:46:50,890 --> 00:46:48,410 remember why but so so but their family 1072 00:46:53,170 --> 00:46:50,900 party and all of a sudden she she felt 1073 00:46:54,490 --> 00:46:53,180 like she said Tesla coils going off the 1074 00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:54,500 length of her spine she's totally 1075 00:46:57,940 --> 00:46:56,050 freaked out she had this weird 1076 00:46:59,680 --> 00:46:57,950 experience running up and down her spine 1077 00:47:01,570 --> 00:46:59,690 she didn't know what it meant she's like 1078 00:47:04,300 --> 00:47:01,580 I gotta get out of here I gotta go and 1079 00:47:05,590 --> 00:47:04,310 she just drove home and and before she 1080 00:47:07,390 --> 00:47:05,600 left she made a range make sure you know 1081 00:47:08,710 --> 00:47:07,400 like like she and everyone knew she was 1082 00:47:10,030 --> 00:47:08,720 leaving she said goodbye and then she 1083 00:47:13,180 --> 00:47:10,040 left and then so she went to her house 1084 00:47:14,740 --> 00:47:13,190 on a beautiful spring day and she was 1085 00:47:17,620 --> 00:47:14,750 living in Massachusetts at the time and 1086 00:47:19,930 --> 00:47:17,630 she lied out on a hammock and as soon as 1087 00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:19,940 she said in the hammock there was an owl 1088 00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:24,170 on one tree right so the hammocks tied 1089 00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:25,850 between two trees owl lands on one tree 1090 00:47:28,599 --> 00:47:27,170 and I'll lands on the other the one 1091 00:47:33,450 --> 00:47:28,609 their feet and the one at her head so 1092 00:47:36,849 --> 00:47:33,460 two owls tied between you know and and 1093 00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:36,859 they they're hooting and she said it 1094 00:47:41,140 --> 00:47:39,650 felt like like they were realigning her 1095 00:47:43,570 --> 00:47:41,150 you know all I can think of is like two 1096 00:47:44,890 --> 00:47:43,580 little like three little circuits on a 1097 00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:44,900 circuit board right and they're all 1098 00:47:49,660 --> 00:47:47,690 wired together there's the two owls and 1099 00:47:50,860 --> 00:47:49,670 there's Susan in the middle and the Owls 1100 00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:50,870 are connected at each end of earn 1101 00:47:57,850 --> 00:47:52,370 they're like recharging a battery or 1102 00:48:00,640 --> 00:47:57,860 something now her husband comes home and 1103 00:48:02,620 --> 00:48:00,650 she says what do you see said well I see 1104 00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:02,630 an owl in the branch there and all in 1105 00:48:05,710 --> 00:48:03,530 the branch there and they're talking 1106 00:48:06,940 --> 00:48:05,720 they're hooting I said yep she was like 1107 00:48:12,060 --> 00:48:06,950 didn't believe it she had to have 1108 00:48:17,440 --> 00:48:14,920 after that she started doing like 1109 00:48:20,230 --> 00:48:17,450 hands-on wasn't technically Reiki but 1110 00:48:22,000 --> 00:48:20,240 hands-on healing work right after that 1111 00:48:24,340 --> 00:48:22,010 so there's this and that shows up all 1112 00:48:26,680 --> 00:48:24,350 the time - in this think now so that 1113 00:48:28,270 --> 00:48:26,690 story arrived in a Monday on a Tuesday I 1114 00:48:29,650 --> 00:48:28,280 get this other story someone sent me an 1115 00:48:31,030 --> 00:48:29,660 essay like it was already pre-written 1116 00:48:33,360 --> 00:48:31,040 they said oh here I got an Alistar 1117 00:48:36,910 --> 00:48:33,370 here's my illustrates all pre-written 1118 00:48:41,590 --> 00:48:36,920 this woman's name is Kelly she's in her 1119 00:48:44,380 --> 00:48:41,600 backyard and she's she's she has had 1120 00:48:46,810 --> 00:48:44,390 experiences that might imply this is the 1121 00:48:49,420 --> 00:48:46,820 maybe person rights it might imply she 1122 00:48:51,730 --> 00:48:49,430 said UFO contact and she's done this 1123 00:48:54,100 --> 00:48:51,740 before and she's just lying out in this 1124 00:48:56,020 --> 00:48:54,110 you know in a very relaxed calm place 1125 00:49:00,490 --> 00:48:56,030 and the hammock in the Sun and she says 1126 00:49:03,190 --> 00:49:00,500 like okay I need confirmation that these 1127 00:49:04,930 --> 00:49:03,200 things are real I need confirmation so 1128 00:49:06,490 --> 00:49:04,940 I'm gonna go I'm just gonna look up at 1129 00:49:09,820 --> 00:49:06,500 this guy and I'm okay with my eyes 1130 00:49:11,830 --> 00:49:09,830 closed I'm gonna go three two one and 1131 00:49:14,050 --> 00:49:11,840 then open my eyes she did it a bunch of 1132 00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:14,060 times she requested confirmation that 1133 00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:16,370 these things she needed proof for our 1134 00:49:21,910 --> 00:49:20,050 own sanity countdown three two one 1135 00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:21,920 nothing nothing happened 1136 00:49:25,570 --> 00:49:23,690 her little son runs up and says mom what 1137 00:49:27,190 --> 00:49:25,580 are you doing he absent in the in these 1138 00:49:28,450 --> 00:49:27,200 like ten years old or nine or ten or ten 1139 00:49:29,290 --> 00:49:28,460 years old hops in the hammock with her 1140 00:49:30,730 --> 00:49:29,300 and she says what are you doing 1141 00:49:32,950 --> 00:49:30,740 I said I'm playing a little game and I'm 1142 00:49:34,900 --> 00:49:32,960 closing my eyes and I look up and let me 1143 00:49:37,240 --> 00:49:34,910 do it I know what you were good so so I 1144 00:49:41,050 --> 00:49:37,250 know what we're playing and without any 1145 00:49:43,900 --> 00:49:41,060 prompting he goes dear God can we see a 1146 00:49:46,060 --> 00:49:43,910 UFO three two one and they open their 1147 00:49:47,350 --> 00:49:46,070 eyes and there's the UFO hovering above 1148 00:49:52,870 --> 00:49:47,360 they're like off in the distance but 1149 00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:52,880 clearly in the line of sight so we have 1150 00:49:54,810 --> 00:49:53,570 these two 1151 00:49:57,220 --> 00:49:54,820 so then it also is funny there's a 1152 00:49:58,270 --> 00:49:57,230 husband she tells a little boy go hit 1153 00:49:59,500 --> 00:49:58,280 the binocular squander what get the 1154 00:50:00,880 --> 00:49:59,510 binocular so she stays in the hammock 1155 00:50:02,260 --> 00:50:00,890 and the boy runs too you know runs the 1156 00:50:04,990 --> 00:50:02,270 house gets binoculars ones back out 1157 00:50:06,670 --> 00:50:05,000 there like like like looking in this 1158 00:50:10,330 --> 00:50:06,680 thing and she described it as I cut like 1159 00:50:14,890 --> 00:50:10,340 a diamond spinning ice cream cone shaped 1160 00:50:16,630 --> 00:50:14,900 diamond with every reflective facet in 1161 00:50:19,330 --> 00:50:16,640 the in the spectrum and colors she'd 1162 00:50:20,710 --> 00:50:19,340 never seen before and then her husband 1163 00:50:22,540 --> 00:50:20,720 comes out and says what are you doing us 1164 00:50:24,310 --> 00:50:22,550 he takes a binoculars and then he won't 1165 00:50:25,780 --> 00:50:24,320 give him back he's like it's T's and 1166 00:50:27,310 --> 00:50:25,790 he's like a nut he doesn't believe in 1167 00:50:29,290 --> 00:50:27,320 his wife's experiences and he doesn't 1168 00:50:31,060 --> 00:50:29,300 give the binoculars back he's like and 1169 00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:31,070 this thing is moving really slowly so 1170 00:50:34,270 --> 00:50:32,210 she had to like walk around the yard 1171 00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:34,280 because it was like descending behind 1172 00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:35,810 the trees and he walked away with the 1173 00:50:39,700 --> 00:50:37,130 binoculars a divyam Peck 1174 00:50:41,830 --> 00:50:39,710 so we have this weird thing where like 1175 00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:41,840 the husband confirms both as both events 1176 00:50:48,010 --> 00:50:43,970 take place a binocular with a with with 1177 00:50:51,430 --> 00:50:48,020 a hammock so you know one is a woman in 1178 00:50:55,180 --> 00:50:51,440 a hammock who has she's an abductee it 1179 00:50:57,820 --> 00:50:55,190 has two owls show up the other one is a 1180 00:50:59,920 --> 00:50:57,830 woman asking for confirmation in a 1181 00:51:01,690 --> 00:50:59,930 hammock and a UFO shows up this I got 1182 00:51:04,540 --> 00:51:01,700 one and up Monday one on a Tuesday and 1183 00:51:07,090 --> 00:51:04,550 they are just it was real well yeah it's 1184 00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:07,100 I this happened over and over and over 1185 00:51:10,090 --> 00:51:08,450 again during the production of this book 1186 00:51:12,220 --> 00:51:10,100 then I would get these stories 1187 00:51:13,570 --> 00:51:12,230 back-to-back and I could deck it I could 1188 00:51:15,130 --> 00:51:13,580 fill the rest of the show up with the 1189 00:51:17,190 --> 00:51:15,140 stories like that back-to-back stories 1190 00:51:21,940 --> 00:51:17,200 that we won in a Monday one on a Tuesday 1191 00:51:24,580 --> 00:51:21,950 and it I just I'm left speechless by 1192 00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:24,590 that and and they the the power of that 1193 00:51:30,910 --> 00:51:28,850 it felt like it felt like these or these 1194 00:51:36,310 --> 00:51:30,920 events were orchestrated specifically 1195 00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:36,320 for me to to clearly recognize the power 1196 00:51:43,030 --> 00:51:40,130 of these symbolic experiences I mean 1197 00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:43,040 what are the odds of getting those 1198 00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:45,890 emails one after the other in both 1199 00:51:50,470 --> 00:51:48,370 talking about an experience in a hammock 1200 00:51:54,610 --> 00:51:50,480 they're infinite I mean there's there is 1201 00:51:56,220 --> 00:51:54,620 no answer is that it's impossible and 1202 00:51:59,290 --> 00:51:56,230 that I was confronted with it repeatedly 1203 00:52:02,590 --> 00:51:59,300 yeah I mean I have yes I mean I could go 1204 00:52:05,950 --> 00:52:02,600 I mean it is so one face so here's a 1205 00:52:07,900 --> 00:52:05,960 fellow you may have even had on the show 1206 00:52:10,809 --> 00:52:07,910 Burt Janssen do you know Burt 1207 00:52:13,990 --> 00:52:10,819 no I don't I know that name or 1208 00:52:15,460 --> 00:52:14,000 researcher out of he's he's he spends 1209 00:52:18,940 --> 00:52:15,470 part of his time in England every summer 1210 00:52:20,529 --> 00:52:18,950 but he's Dutch and he this would have 1211 00:52:22,270 --> 00:52:20,539 been in the mid-90s and he had been 1212 00:52:23,829 --> 00:52:22,280 researching crop circles for three years 1213 00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:23,839 and he says well I'm done you know like 1214 00:52:27,099 --> 00:52:25,490 I've done everything I can do about crop 1215 00:52:28,569 --> 00:52:27,109 circles I'm done with research and crop 1216 00:52:29,079 --> 00:52:28,579 circles he's in this field and the Sun 1217 00:52:30,819 --> 00:52:29,089 is setting 1218 00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:30,829 he looks off and there's this orange orb 1219 00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:33,410 of floating across the field and it 1220 00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:35,210 floats around and it gets big and it 1221 00:52:37,779 --> 00:52:36,650 gets small like it's the size of a 1222 00:52:39,609 --> 00:52:37,789 balloon it gets the size a little 1223 00:52:41,980 --> 00:52:39,619 ping-pong ball and it zips around and 1224 00:52:43,299 --> 00:52:41,990 then it dips along and he's watching it 1225 00:52:44,589 --> 00:52:43,309 go along the edge of the field and 1226 00:52:46,120 --> 00:52:44,599 there's this shed at the edge of the 1227 00:52:47,980 --> 00:52:46,130 field that's kind of high up in the shed 1228 00:52:49,150 --> 00:52:47,990 and it he's waiting for it cause it's 1229 00:52:50,140 --> 00:52:49,160 behind the shed and he's waiting it for 1230 00:52:54,010 --> 00:52:50,150 it to come out the other side of it 1231 00:52:57,010 --> 00:52:54,020 doesn't and he's like could it be could 1232 00:52:58,690 --> 00:52:57,020 it have gone in the shed and so he went 1233 00:53:01,660 --> 00:52:58,700 over the shed and he and the shed was 1234 00:53:04,120 --> 00:53:01,670 locked and so he walked around the back 1235 00:53:06,190 --> 00:53:04,130 and there was a broken window right 1236 00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:06,200 where that where that about the level 1237 00:53:10,630 --> 00:53:09,530 that this orange orb had zipped by so he 1238 00:53:11,950 --> 00:53:10,640 goes to the front of the shed and tries 1239 00:53:13,299 --> 00:53:11,960 to open the door he puts his ear up to 1240 00:53:18,460 --> 00:53:13,309 the orc door and hears this eerie 1241 00:53:20,769 --> 00:53:18,470 hissing noises and it's Sun is going 1242 00:53:22,059 --> 00:53:20,779 down and goes I'll come back tomorrow so 1243 00:53:23,769 --> 00:53:22,069 he comes back tomorrow and like and I 1244 00:53:25,450 --> 00:53:23,779 asked him it's like how'd you got you 1245 00:53:30,039 --> 00:53:25,460 get in that shed he said I broke the 1246 00:53:31,420 --> 00:53:30,049 lock weights lock and he and he walks 1247 00:53:35,620 --> 00:53:31,430 into the shed there's this eerie hissing 1248 00:53:38,019 --> 00:53:35,630 yes and he looks up and there's this 1249 00:53:39,519 --> 00:53:38,029 loft with a ladder and he climbs up the 1250 00:53:42,730 --> 00:53:39,529 ladder and he gets the ladder this is 1251 00:53:45,480 --> 00:53:42,740 hissing noise head and he peeks over the 1252 00:53:49,779 --> 00:53:45,490 edge and there's a family of baby owls 1253 00:53:52,480 --> 00:53:49,789 right right where the what seemed like 1254 00:53:55,000 --> 00:53:52,490 the orange orb entered the shed so here 1255 00:53:57,220 --> 00:53:55,010 we have and if you listen to the barn 1256 00:53:58,690 --> 00:53:57,230 owls they'd say white bernal's they make 1257 00:54:02,170 --> 00:53:58,700 you they make a creepy creepy noise 1258 00:54:04,299 --> 00:54:02,180 especially when they're babies now this 1259 00:54:06,099 --> 00:54:04,309 wasn't quite the next day but it was 1260 00:54:09,940 --> 00:54:06,109 very shortly thereafter I talked to a 1261 00:54:13,510 --> 00:54:09,950 woman named Maria Wheatley she's a she's 1262 00:54:14,859 --> 00:54:13,520 a researches ancient sites in England 1263 00:54:18,339 --> 00:54:14,869 and also does some crop circle research 1264 00:54:20,859 --> 00:54:18,349 and this is she went on she was going to 1265 00:54:21,790 --> 00:54:20,869 go on a hike with a friend and they were 1266 00:54:23,290 --> 00:54:21,800 gonna walk into the 1267 00:54:27,010 --> 00:54:23,300 since they walked on this trail and as 1268 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:27,020 soon as they stepped onto the trail this 1269 00:54:31,960 --> 00:54:30,050 owl swooped in front of him crossing 1270 00:54:34,230 --> 00:54:31,970 bisecting the trail of white owl and 1271 00:54:37,810 --> 00:54:34,240 they both her and her friend both Oh 1272 00:54:39,970 --> 00:54:37,820 both like I'll make this quick both got 1273 00:54:42,130 --> 00:54:39,980 it they got the message we are not 1274 00:54:43,330 --> 00:54:42,140 allowed on this trail so they turned 1275 00:54:45,220 --> 00:54:43,340 around I said what are we gonna do let's 1276 00:54:46,990 --> 00:54:45,230 go hike up this hilltop so they walked 1277 00:54:48,910 --> 00:54:47,000 up this hill tops called Oliver's castle 1278 00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:48,920 oftentimes the hilltops in wheelchair 1279 00:54:53,050 --> 00:54:51,050 are called decay angles and like the 1280 00:54:54,340 --> 00:54:53,060 that and so they walked up this hill 1281 00:54:56,830 --> 00:54:54,350 there's no castle at the top if that's 1282 00:54:58,030 --> 00:54:56,840 what's called and they get to the top 1283 00:55:00,190 --> 00:54:58,040 and they watch the sunset and then off 1284 00:55:02,200 --> 00:55:00,200 in the distance this orange dot sort of 1285 00:55:03,910 --> 00:55:02,210 starts coming to them and it gets big 1286 00:55:06,610 --> 00:55:03,920 and it grows and it grows to the size of 1287 00:55:08,770 --> 00:55:06,620 a huge giant cigar shaped craft and and 1288 00:55:10,060 --> 00:55:08,780 it gets closer and closer and freaks him 1289 00:55:13,420 --> 00:55:10,070 out and they're panicking and then it 1290 00:55:14,620 --> 00:55:13,430 shrinks down in disappears and they run 1291 00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:14,630 back down to the car she said her friend 1292 00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:16,010 was shaking so bad he couldn't get the 1293 00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:19,970 keys in the card and and and afterwards 1294 00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:23,210 she said her psychic powers he was doing 1295 00:55:29,200 --> 00:55:25,850 a lot of tarot readings and she said her 1296 00:55:31,270 --> 00:55:29,210 she felt her in her psychic powers were 1297 00:55:32,710 --> 00:55:31,280 boosted he felt the same thing out of 1298 00:55:35,590 --> 00:55:32,720 nowhere he had all suddenly had these 1299 00:55:38,260 --> 00:55:35,600 psychic powers they've since dialed back 1300 00:55:40,920 --> 00:55:38,270 a bit so here we have two stories both 1301 00:55:45,520 --> 00:55:40,930 in the same area Wiltshire 1302 00:55:49,240 --> 00:55:45,530 seem to take place one man has an orange 1303 00:55:52,180 --> 00:55:49,250 orb lead him to owls the other this 1304 00:55:54,130 --> 00:55:52,190 woman has an owl that leads her to an 1305 00:55:58,200 --> 00:55:54,140 orange orb Anora I mean orange orb is a 1306 00:56:01,660 --> 00:55:58,210 UFO so there's in there bacca back and 1307 00:56:04,090 --> 00:56:01,670 and so this is and now we'll say that 1308 00:56:06,850 --> 00:56:04,100 that the fellow Burt was considering 1309 00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:06,860 dropping out of crop circle research had 1310 00:56:10,930 --> 00:56:08,930 this experience this is now you know 1311 00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:10,940 well over ten years later he's stealing 1312 00:56:16,120 --> 00:56:12,650 almost twenty years later he's still 1313 00:56:18,790 --> 00:56:16,130 doing crop circle research wow that's 1314 00:56:21,070 --> 00:56:18,800 wild you know I haven't I haven't had 1315 00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:21,080 Burt on but I have had Maria Wheatley on 1316 00:56:27,070 --> 00:56:23,210 and she's wonderful yeah she really is 1317 00:56:30,170 --> 00:56:27,080 we had a ball it was great but you know 1318 00:56:32,390 --> 00:56:30,180 what it's time for another break so 1319 00:56:34,820 --> 00:56:32,400 we will make it a quick one and we'll be 1320 00:56:42,410 --> 00:56:34,830 back shortly with Mike Cleland and more 1321 00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:42,420 on owls stay with us welcome back to 1322 00:56:45,290 --> 00:56:43,050 night vision 1323 00:56:47,060 --> 00:56:45,300 I'm Renee Barnett your host and with me 1324 00:56:50,570 --> 00:56:47,070 tonight is Mike Cleland we're talking 1325 00:56:54,890 --> 00:56:50,580 about his book met the messengers owls 1326 00:56:57,530 --> 00:56:54,900 synchronicity and the UFO abduction a 1327 00:57:00,020 --> 00:56:57,540 bit offline as I often do sometimes we 1328 00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:00,030 get a some of the best stories while 1329 00:57:04,550 --> 00:57:02,490 we're on our break but I usually try to 1330 00:57:06,830 --> 00:57:04,560 share them when we come back but Mike 1331 00:57:09,800 --> 00:57:06,840 you were telling me that you are working 1332 00:57:12,080 --> 00:57:09,810 on a second book on the same subject I 1333 00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:12,090 am I'm stuck with owls yet what happened 1334 00:57:16,010 --> 00:57:13,410 was when I did the first book the book 1335 00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:16,020 first books like nearly 400 pages long 1336 00:57:19,880 --> 00:57:17,850 and is like how to say it you know like 1337 00:57:22,340 --> 00:57:19,890 if you like it's a kind of a poor 1338 00:57:24,890 --> 00:57:22,350 marketing decision to make a big fat 1339 00:57:26,030 --> 00:57:24,900 book but um Richard Dolan is the 1340 00:57:28,010 --> 00:57:26,040 publisher and we had a long talk about 1341 00:57:30,200 --> 00:57:28,020 you know like how big the book seemed to 1342 00:57:31,460 --> 00:57:30,210 be getting and he was like listen no 1343 00:57:33,250 --> 00:57:31,470 one's ever covered this that's covered 1344 00:57:35,720 --> 00:57:33,260 completely let's just do it right and so 1345 00:57:38,780 --> 00:57:35,730 this what happened was I had a bunch of 1346 00:57:40,430 --> 00:57:38,790 stories left over and in the in the 1347 00:57:43,100 --> 00:57:40,440 intervening year or so I've I've 1348 00:57:45,290 --> 00:57:43,110 collected even more and I went through 1349 00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:45,300 and I some of this so what happens is 1350 00:57:49,340 --> 00:57:47,130 and you've probably noticed this too is 1351 00:57:53,390 --> 00:57:49,350 that people have these types of 1352 00:57:55,430 --> 00:57:53,400 experiences often their stories just 1353 00:57:58,420 --> 00:57:55,440 seem to go on and on and just have these 1354 00:58:01,130 --> 00:57:58,430 weird details and there's this kind of 1355 00:58:03,170 --> 00:58:01,140 chaos almost like it doesn't all that 1356 00:58:04,610 --> 00:58:03,180 all this weird stuff doesn't make sense 1357 00:58:06,470 --> 00:58:04,620 it doesn't it doesn't the puzzle pieces 1358 00:58:12,340 --> 00:58:06,480 don't fit together nice and tidy like it 1359 00:58:14,420 --> 00:58:12,350 would in a piece of fiction so I've been 1360 00:58:16,670 --> 00:58:14,430 working on these stories of the book 1361 00:58:21,530 --> 00:58:16,680 should be it's either 16 or 17 short 1362 00:58:22,910 --> 00:58:21,540 stories and these short stories you know 1363 00:58:25,030 --> 00:58:22,920 so it'll read like a collection of short 1364 00:58:28,850 --> 00:58:25,040 stories it might be about 200 pages and 1365 00:58:32,620 --> 00:58:28,860 they're there each each of the stories 1366 00:58:35,810 --> 00:58:32,630 you sort of try I try to exemplify that 1367 00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:35,820 that messiness in a way where these 1368 00:58:42,260 --> 00:58:38,130 people have all these outlying events in 1369 00:58:43,670 --> 00:58:42,270 their life and and now in the the format 1370 00:58:45,260 --> 00:58:43,680 of the first book 1371 00:58:47,210 --> 00:58:45,270 wouldn't know how allowed that to tell 1372 00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:47,220 each you know so I tell stories and the 1373 00:58:49,640 --> 00:58:48,450 first book and a lot of them but I kind 1374 00:58:52,250 --> 00:58:49,650 of have to zip right through them and 1375 00:58:54,230 --> 00:58:52,260 just just tell them very sparsely and be 1376 00:58:58,490 --> 00:58:54,240 and I felt bad doing that because each 1377 00:59:00,740 --> 00:58:58,500 behind each story was like a novel 1378 00:59:02,660 --> 00:59:00,750 waiting to be written in a way and I 1379 00:59:04,790 --> 00:59:02,670 recognize that and I apologized to the 1380 00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:04,800 folks that in the foreword I apologize 1381 00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:07,530 that I that I didn't cover their stories 1382 00:59:10,880 --> 00:59:08,970 as completely as I could but that just 1383 00:59:12,410 --> 00:59:10,890 the the the reality that would have I 1384 00:59:13,970 --> 00:59:12,420 would have the the reader would have 1385 00:59:15,200 --> 00:59:13,980 been bogged down I think it would've 1386 00:59:17,030 --> 00:59:15,210 been bogged down an interesting stuff 1387 00:59:19,309 --> 00:59:17,040 and interesting and me at least but but 1388 00:59:21,079 --> 00:59:19,319 I had to make that that that that book 1389 00:59:23,450 --> 00:59:21,089 that you have to kind of zippy and kind 1390 00:59:26,120 --> 00:59:23,460 of race along or would have been unfair 1391 00:59:28,760 --> 00:59:26,130 to the reader I look the way the book is 1392 00:59:31,700 --> 00:59:28,770 put together and it's a it's a great 1393 00:59:34,430 --> 00:59:31,710 reference book because it the table of 1394 00:59:36,650 --> 00:59:34,440 contents is very detailed so you can 1395 00:59:38,510 --> 00:59:36,660 find what you're looking for you know 1396 00:59:40,549 --> 00:59:38,520 really quickly and plus you've done a 1397 00:59:43,250 --> 00:59:40,559 really good job on the index as well III 1398 00:59:45,049 --> 00:59:43,260 I love things like that and so that I 1399 00:59:47,270 --> 00:59:45,059 can pick up a book and if I would say oh 1400 00:59:49,069 --> 00:59:47,280 where was that that you know where he 1401 00:59:51,049 --> 00:59:49,079 was talking about you know the movie the 1402 00:59:54,680 --> 00:59:51,059 Fourth Kind and then I can find it so 1403 00:59:56,420 --> 00:59:54,690 easily and so quickly it's very well put 1404 01:00:00,500 --> 00:59:56,430 together and yeah it is 1405 01:00:02,960 --> 01:00:00,510 I Barry not only to read it through but 1406 01:00:05,740 --> 01:00:02,970 also as I said to keep it for reference 1407 01:00:08,510 --> 01:00:05,750 that's what I'm going to use mine for 1408 01:00:11,359 --> 01:00:08,520 you know a lot of the stories are sure 1409 01:00:12,859 --> 01:00:11,369 kind of told with little subheaders and 1410 01:00:14,390 --> 01:00:12,869 things like that so as silly as it 1411 01:00:15,950 --> 01:00:14,400 sounds you can pick that book up and 1412 01:00:19,460 --> 01:00:15,960 just open it up anywhere that's what I 1413 01:00:21,230 --> 01:00:19,470 you know and you really can and once you 1414 01:00:22,339 --> 01:00:21,240 get the gist of it you it's not like 1415 01:00:24,319 --> 01:00:22,349 you're it's not like it's a it's a 1416 01:00:25,730 --> 01:00:24,329 single narrative like you're gonna be 1417 01:00:27,950 --> 01:00:25,740 mixed up if you like wait a minute what 1418 01:00:29,960 --> 01:00:27,960 did I miss - this you know so it because 1419 01:00:32,299 --> 01:00:29,970 all the little individual stories and 1420 01:00:37,730 --> 01:00:32,309 there are hundreds of them in there you 1421 01:00:41,630 --> 01:00:37,740 know all read you know clearly yeah 1422 01:00:44,539 --> 01:00:41,640 absolutely absolutely now I I think I 1423 01:00:46,370 --> 01:00:44,549 would be remiss if I didn't bring up 1424 01:00:49,039 --> 01:00:46,380 something that you did address in the 1425 01:00:51,859 --> 01:00:49,049 book because the chatroom has definitely 1426 01:00:57,070 --> 01:00:51,869 brought it up and that is the the big 1427 01:01:03,280 --> 01:00:59,710 what's your sense of of what that's all 1428 01:01:06,250 --> 01:01:03,290 about or why they might have that there 1429 01:01:10,320 --> 01:01:06,260 so the Bohemian Grove is a men's club in 1430 01:01:12,250 --> 01:01:10,330 in San Francisco and very late very late 1431 01:01:14,500 --> 01:01:12,260 the elite the elite of the elite 1432 01:01:16,150 --> 01:01:14,510 presidents and presidents to be and the 1433 01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:16,160 you know heads of state and heads of 1434 01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:17,930 industry and and I think a lot of 1435 01:01:21,490 --> 01:01:19,850 decision-making goes down there that 1436 01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:21,500 that you know very much behind the 1437 01:01:26,650 --> 01:01:24,650 scenes very secretive you know that and 1438 01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:26,660 there you try to oh my god research 1439 01:01:30,730 --> 01:01:28,730 Bohemian Grove online I mean you get you 1440 01:01:32,680 --> 01:01:30,740 get all you know they get you know 1441 01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:32,690 people drinking babies blood and stuff 1442 01:01:35,380 --> 01:01:34,130 like that there's this you know this I 1443 01:01:37,060 --> 01:01:35,390 mean I don't know what to believe so I 1444 01:01:40,750 --> 01:01:37,070 was very cautious how I addressed it in 1445 01:01:43,030 --> 01:01:40,760 in in the book but right on the door of 1446 01:01:44,680 --> 01:01:43,040 the Bohemian Club right this Bohemian 1447 01:01:46,090 --> 01:01:44,690 Grove is off in Northern California in 1448 01:01:48,310 --> 01:01:46,100 the redwoods and it's a private club 1449 01:01:50,260 --> 01:01:48,320 that's off in the woods and and but 1450 01:01:52,990 --> 01:01:50,270 right on right in the neighborhood of 1451 01:01:55,330 --> 01:01:53,000 you know downtown San Francisco is the 1452 01:01:57,010 --> 01:01:55,340 Bohemian Club it's a men's club it looks 1453 01:01:58,390 --> 01:01:57,020 like you know exactly what you would 1454 01:02:00,820 --> 01:01:58,400 picture a men's club to look like you 1455 01:02:02,050 --> 01:02:00,830 know you know kind of a and and right on 1456 01:02:03,790 --> 01:02:02,060 the door right above you walk in the 1457 01:02:06,070 --> 01:02:03,800 door it has a thing that's as weaving 1458 01:02:09,210 --> 01:02:06,080 spiders come not here and that's the the 1459 01:02:11,410 --> 01:02:09,220 myth of Arachnia and Arachnia is a 1460 01:02:14,860 --> 01:02:11,420 that's where we get this term spider 1461 01:02:20,410 --> 01:02:14,870 from the woman's name Arachnia and she 1462 01:02:22,540 --> 01:02:20,420 was a and so not only is Athena the 1463 01:02:24,610 --> 01:02:22,550 goddess of wisdom she's also the gun 1464 01:02:27,250 --> 01:02:24,620 you're listening to love advice with 1465 01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:27,260 Leeanne caller you're on the air hi 1466 01:02:31,540 --> 01:02:28,730 LeeAnn longtime listener first-time 1467 01:02:33,880 --> 01:02:31,550 caller why in your professional opinion 1468 01:02:37,420 --> 01:02:33,890 do you never take my calls off the air 1469 01:02:38,830 --> 01:02:37,430 is this Carl yep it's Carl we had a few 1470 01:02:42,400 --> 01:02:38,840 dates everything was great I thought 1471 01:02:44,500 --> 01:02:42,410 well you know when you switch to Geico 1472 01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:44,510 you could save a lot of money on car 1473 01:02:50,080 --> 01:02:46,970 insurance okay awesome you should call 1474 01:02:51,970 --> 01:02:50,090 them I will Geico because saving 15% or 1475 01:02:54,100 --> 01:02:51,980 more on car insurance is always a great 1476 01:02:59,470 --> 01:02:54,110 answer goddess of Arts and Crafts or 1477 01:03:04,020 --> 01:02:59,480 crafts craftsmanship and so the there 1478 01:03:06,280 --> 01:03:04,030 was like a duel between Athena and 1479 01:03:08,410 --> 01:03:06,290 Arachnia and Arachnia and this is an 1480 01:03:10,540 --> 01:03:08,420 ancient Greek myth you know it was a 1481 01:03:12,310 --> 01:03:10,550 weaver and so she was on her loom and 1482 01:03:14,530 --> 01:03:12,320 was weaving and she was making this 1483 01:03:19,090 --> 01:03:14,540 tapestry and she was putting all these 1484 01:03:23,230 --> 01:03:19,100 you know sarcastic images of the gods in 1485 01:03:25,090 --> 01:03:23,240 the in the in in the tapestry and her 1486 01:03:27,280 --> 01:03:25,100 tapestry was more beautiful than the 1487 01:03:30,130 --> 01:03:27,290 tapestry created by Athena and Athena 1488 01:03:32,650 --> 01:03:30,140 had a fit turned Arachnia into a spider 1489 01:03:34,540 --> 01:03:32,660 and that's where we get the term you 1490 01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:34,550 know so so it says right on the door 1491 01:03:38,980 --> 01:03:36,410 weaving spiders come not here and that's 1492 01:03:41,700 --> 01:03:38,990 straight up a reference to Athena 1493 01:03:44,740 --> 01:03:41,710 goddess of wisdom which is perfectly 1494 01:03:49,330 --> 01:03:44,750 appropriate for a men's club where 1495 01:03:51,130 --> 01:03:49,340 they're trying to you know you know push 1496 01:03:52,900 --> 01:03:51,140 their agendas and stuff like that so and 1497 01:03:53,980 --> 01:03:52,910 also the the Capitol building if you 1498 01:03:56,890 --> 01:03:53,990 look at the Capitol building in a 1499 01:04:00,940 --> 01:03:56,900 satellite photograph in Washington DC 1500 01:04:03,070 --> 01:04:00,950 there's a very clear owl imagery in the 1501 01:04:05,440 --> 01:04:03,080 way that the roads and the lawns and the 1502 01:04:08,980 --> 01:04:05,450 parks are arranged around the Capitol 1503 01:04:10,390 --> 01:04:08,990 building and it's it's not you don't 1504 01:04:12,370 --> 01:04:10,400 have to squint your eyes to see it it's 1505 01:04:13,870 --> 01:04:12,380 very it's right there so the Capitol 1506 01:04:17,530 --> 01:04:13,880 building of the United States of America 1507 01:04:21,250 --> 01:04:17,540 is embedded within a symbolic owl that 1508 01:04:25,540 --> 01:04:21,260 can only be seen from the sky or a map I 1509 01:04:27,700 --> 01:04:25,550 guess so you know like a really cautious 1510 01:04:29,680 --> 01:04:27,710 to look into the deeper conspiracies 1511 01:04:31,870 --> 01:04:29,690 because I'm sure that there's that 1512 01:04:35,620 --> 01:04:31,880 there's decision-making that takes place 1513 01:04:38,350 --> 01:04:35,630 there that you know I don't know I mean 1514 01:04:41,170 --> 01:04:38,360 people make decisions and and agendas in 1515 01:04:43,000 --> 01:04:41,180 in secret that's by its definition and 1516 01:04:45,310 --> 01:04:43,010 conspiracies so yes so there's there's 1517 01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:45,320 you know at the bite by the textbook 1518 01:04:48,250 --> 01:04:46,730 definition of what a conspiracy is 1519 01:04:51,250 --> 01:04:48,260 there's you know that's taking place in 1520 01:04:53,230 --> 01:04:51,260 some form or another there what might be 1521 01:04:56,770 --> 01:04:53,240 going on there I simply have no idea and 1522 01:05:00,070 --> 01:04:56,780 can only address the oh the the sort of 1523 01:05:02,350 --> 01:05:00,080 myths of that place but yes there's a 1524 01:05:04,570 --> 01:05:02,360 great big giant owl the owl is spun some 1525 01:05:07,240 --> 01:05:04,580 accounts called Moloch and in ancient 1526 01:05:09,550 --> 01:05:07,250 mythology Moloch is actually a bull so 1527 01:05:11,470 --> 01:05:09,560 and then that that owl is is a big 1528 01:05:13,450 --> 01:05:11,480 cement owl is my understanding it looks 1529 01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:13,460 like a natural featured rock but I think 1530 01:05:17,550 --> 01:05:14,690 it's made out of cement or it's a 1531 01:05:19,780 --> 01:05:17,560 natural feature of a rock that has been 1532 01:05:22,140 --> 01:05:19,790 you know doctored with cement to look 1533 01:05:23,589 --> 01:05:22,150 like an owl 1534 01:05:27,099 --> 01:05:23,599 interesting 1535 01:05:28,900 --> 01:05:27,109 yeah the I'm actually looking online at 1536 01:05:32,289 --> 01:05:28,910 some images of the of the capital I 1537 01:05:35,439 --> 01:05:32,299 think I do see that in that it is look I 1538 01:05:37,420 --> 01:05:35,449 can see two big round eyes yeah those 1539 01:05:39,939 --> 01:05:37,430 are two parks and that way that way yeah 1540 01:05:42,579 --> 01:05:39,949 yeah the the little roads they have 1541 01:05:47,319 --> 01:05:42,589 little horn two ears just like a great 1542 01:05:50,620 --> 01:05:47,329 horned owl yeah oh yes I just I I made 1543 01:05:52,839 --> 01:05:50,630 it larger and it was really yeah it's 1544 01:05:54,249 --> 01:05:52,849 right there it's it's it's it's in it I 1545 01:05:55,089 --> 01:05:54,259 don't think that happened by accident 1546 01:06:04,089 --> 01:05:55,099 yeah 1547 01:06:08,380 --> 01:06:04,099 mind sharing with us a little bit more 1548 01:06:12,489 --> 01:06:08,390 about the book in terms of you know Al's 1549 01:06:13,900 --> 01:06:12,499 as archetypes well so archetype is one 1550 01:06:16,719 --> 01:06:13,910 of those tough terms right so that's 1551 01:06:18,999 --> 01:06:16,729 like you hang out at a you know the 1552 01:06:20,229 --> 01:06:19,009 college dormitory and with a bunch of 1553 01:06:21,579 --> 01:06:20,239 philosophy majors and they're going to 1554 01:06:27,519 --> 01:06:21,589 stay up all late at night trying to 1555 01:06:33,339 --> 01:06:27,529 define what an archetype is so wow this 1556 01:06:35,799 --> 01:06:33,349 is did I so here let me back up this I 1557 01:06:39,969 --> 01:06:35,809 didn't I didn't I didn't set out to like 1558 01:06:42,099 --> 01:06:39,979 look up the archetype thing I got a book 1559 01:06:44,019 --> 01:06:42,109 there's a woman she's an animal 1560 01:06:46,420 --> 01:06:44,029 communicator I've met her at UFO 1561 01:06:48,189 --> 01:06:46,430 conferences and she does straight animal 1562 01:06:49,989 --> 01:06:48,199 communication she talks to dogs and cats 1563 01:06:51,279 --> 01:06:49,999 and horses and she's she's kind of 1564 01:06:54,699 --> 01:06:51,289 psychic and she's a very sweet 1565 01:06:58,289 --> 01:06:54,709 soft-spoken lady her name is Jaclyn 1566 01:07:00,489 --> 01:06:58,299 Smith and and she wrote a book called 1567 01:07:02,140 --> 01:07:00,499 star origins I think that's what the 1568 01:07:04,779 --> 01:07:02,150 name of the book is and it talks and she 1569 01:07:06,189 --> 01:07:04,789 basically channels animals she's very 1570 01:07:08,650 --> 01:07:06,199 clear it's not the animal itself it's 1571 01:07:09,999 --> 01:07:08,660 the spirit of the animal so she was 1572 01:07:11,589 --> 01:07:10,009 walking in the woods and she saw this 1573 01:07:12,819 --> 01:07:11,599 owl day after day where every time she'd 1574 01:07:14,739 --> 01:07:12,829 walk and then finally she looked up at 1575 01:07:16,359 --> 01:07:14,749 this owl and said it's so nice to see 1576 01:07:19,959 --> 01:07:16,369 you do you have a message for me in this 1577 01:07:22,359 --> 01:07:19,969 owl used telepathy to give her a message 1578 01:07:25,269 --> 01:07:22,369 now like I can't vouch for the validity 1579 01:07:26,769 --> 01:07:25,279 of this it's a wonderful story and so I 1580 01:07:28,539 --> 01:07:26,779 talked her a night and this is and the 1581 01:07:30,009 --> 01:07:28,549 stuff in the book was great I'm like oh 1582 01:07:33,459 --> 01:07:30,019 my god I go this is so good and so I 1583 01:07:34,890 --> 01:07:33,469 called her up and I'm so glad I recorded 1584 01:07:36,420 --> 01:07:34,900 this call 1585 01:07:37,710 --> 01:07:36,430 I don't have the book right in front of 1586 01:07:41,670 --> 01:07:37,720 me so I can't read from it but it's 1587 01:07:45,529 --> 01:07:41,680 transcribed in the book I said listen if 1588 01:07:50,579 --> 01:07:45,539 you see that all again you asked for me 1589 01:07:52,260 --> 01:07:50,589 why why the owl is you know just 1590 01:07:53,430 --> 01:07:52,270 connected to the UFO thing what is going 1591 01:07:56,160 --> 01:07:53,440 on with UFOs and owls 1592 01:07:57,329 --> 01:07:56,170 like just you ask yeah and she's talking 1593 01:08:00,690 --> 01:07:57,339 with me and all of a sudden she gets 1594 01:08:03,059 --> 01:08:00,700 very halting and her voice changes and 1595 01:08:07,079 --> 01:08:03,069 she literally just kind of whispers as 1596 01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:07,089 she talks she goes words words as if 1597 01:08:15,269 --> 01:08:10,690 words aren't quite enough and then she 1598 01:08:19,590 --> 01:08:15,279 says she gives the best like three 1599 01:08:23,370 --> 01:08:19,600 sentence definition of archetype she 1600 01:08:27,090 --> 01:08:23,380 says somehow an archetype the owl 1601 01:08:28,620 --> 01:08:27,100 archetype is imbued in our DNA we all 1602 01:08:30,599 --> 01:08:28,630 know what we recognize it on a 1603 01:08:33,419 --> 01:08:30,609 subconscious level we don't have a 1604 01:08:36,649 --> 01:08:33,429 conscious knowing of what it is but all 1605 01:08:41,189 --> 01:08:36,659 of us all of humanity is has an embedded 1606 01:08:45,180 --> 01:08:41,199 archetypal knowledge of what an owl 1607 01:08:47,490 --> 01:08:45,190 means and and that's true of a lot of 1608 01:08:49,740 --> 01:08:47,500 things right so Luke Skywalker is the 1609 01:08:51,479 --> 01:08:49,750 archetype of the hero you know so 1610 01:08:55,649 --> 01:08:51,489 there's there's things that we have that 1611 01:08:59,970 --> 01:08:55,659 are there clearly archetypes when she 1612 01:09:02,189 --> 01:08:59,980 said that it was like the bell rang all 1613 01:09:04,499 --> 01:09:02,199 of a sudden all this disparate stuff 1614 01:09:06,300 --> 01:09:04,509 that I couldn't make sense of in my 1615 01:09:07,800 --> 01:09:06,310 research just click together it just 1616 01:09:09,360 --> 01:09:07,810 felt like the it felt like all of a 1617 01:09:10,499 --> 01:09:09,370 sudden all the puzzle pieces like on the 1618 01:09:11,789 --> 01:09:10,509 table like wait a minute it goes here 1619 01:09:14,189 --> 01:09:11,799 this goes here they click perfectly 1620 01:09:15,749 --> 01:09:14,199 together and all I needed was that that 1621 01:09:17,249 --> 01:09:15,759 archetype that definition of the 1622 01:09:19,740 --> 01:09:17,259 archetype that definition came from a 1623 01:09:21,269 --> 01:09:19,750 woman channeling and I also asked her so 1624 01:09:23,249 --> 01:09:21,279 what's your neck box next book on she 1625 01:09:25,229 --> 01:09:23,259 said while my next book is on my own UFO 1626 01:09:28,709 --> 01:09:25,239 experiences around contact experiences 1627 01:09:32,820 --> 01:09:28,719 so here's a UFO abductee an experiencer 1628 01:09:34,860 --> 01:09:32,830 contactee it's very open with it she 1629 01:09:37,709 --> 01:09:34,870 channels an owl while I'm on the phone 1630 01:09:40,800 --> 01:09:37,719 with her she gives me the perfect answer 1631 01:09:45,629 --> 01:09:40,810 that that oh everything aligns up in my 1632 01:09:48,450 --> 01:09:45,639 in my research after that so so the art 1633 01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:48,460 an owl as an archetype right 1634 01:09:52,470 --> 01:09:50,770 so you watch Star Wars right you're 1635 01:09:54,600 --> 01:09:52,480 swept away in the special effects and 1636 01:09:56,880 --> 01:09:54,610 the story and it's exciting but you are 1637 01:10:00,180 --> 01:09:56,890 seeing a hero's journey you're seeing an 1638 01:10:02,610 --> 01:10:00,190 archetypal journey that's been retold 1639 01:10:04,470 --> 01:10:02,620 throughout the ages if you go into the 1640 01:10:07,080 --> 01:10:04,480 woods at night and see an owl on a 1641 01:10:10,530 --> 01:10:07,090 branch you are seeing an archetype you 1642 01:10:15,500 --> 01:10:10,540 are seeing something that has been 1643 01:10:18,540 --> 01:10:15,510 imbued and imbedded like with a pure 1644 01:10:21,630 --> 01:10:18,550 thought or idea is associated with that 1645 01:10:24,570 --> 01:10:21,640 owl and and everyone in humanity somehow 1646 01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:24,580 has that hardwired into our into our 1647 01:10:29,430 --> 01:10:27,250 subconscious it's not easy to define but 1648 01:10:31,020 --> 01:10:29,440 it's there buried within us and I 1649 01:10:33,120 --> 01:10:31,030 believe that and I recognize that and 1650 01:10:34,709 --> 01:10:33,130 that's my sense of why the owls are 1651 01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:34,719 showing up she said the owls were 1652 01:10:42,300 --> 01:10:40,330 showing up before UFO contact and I 1653 01:10:43,650 --> 01:10:42,310 wrestle with this and I danced around 1654 01:10:45,180 --> 01:10:43,660 this in the book and stuff like that 1655 01:10:46,260 --> 01:10:45,190 night and I recognize where she's coming 1656 01:10:47,700 --> 01:10:46,270 from but this is what people are 1657 01:10:49,080 --> 01:10:47,710 reporting you know they'll say like oh 1658 01:10:51,060 --> 01:10:49,090 you know like I was going through a time 1659 01:10:53,760 --> 01:10:51,070 of a lot of UFO contact you know you've 1660 01:10:55,290 --> 01:10:53,770 talked to abductees and think there's 1661 01:10:56,490 --> 01:10:55,300 these waves where they just feels like 1662 01:10:57,870 --> 01:10:56,500 they're being taken multiple times a 1663 01:10:58,979 --> 01:10:57,880 weekend and when I talk to these folks 1664 01:11:01,080 --> 01:10:58,989 they'll say you know when there was an 1665 01:11:02,520 --> 01:11:01,090 owl living in my you know the tree right 1666 01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:02,530 outside my bedroom window during all 1667 01:11:10,020 --> 01:11:06,610 that time so here's like this totem this 1668 01:11:12,000 --> 01:11:10,030 archetypal totem there for a reason what 1669 01:11:17,310 --> 01:11:12,010 that reason is is a little slippery but 1670 01:11:19,970 --> 01:11:17,320 it is there you know I know in the in 1671 01:11:23,070 --> 01:11:19,980 the book you say you know you're still 1672 01:11:25,680 --> 01:11:23,080 researching you're still you know trying 1673 01:11:28,709 --> 01:11:25,690 to figure out the ultimate meaning of 1674 01:11:32,820 --> 01:11:28,719 all this but that what you do know is 1675 01:11:36,840 --> 01:11:32,830 that somehow these experiences have 1676 01:11:37,440 --> 01:11:36,850 changed you and you know changed your 1677 01:11:40,250 --> 01:11:37,450 life 1678 01:11:43,800 --> 01:11:40,260 can you go into that a little bit how 1679 01:11:47,040 --> 01:11:43,810 how did that happen and you changed from 1680 01:11:49,350 --> 01:11:47,050 what to what and in what manner has it 1681 01:11:51,020 --> 01:11:49,360 affected your life well I you know it's 1682 01:11:53,160 --> 01:11:51,030 a I'd say the book was like you know 1683 01:11:54,390 --> 01:11:53,170 it's all I don't know it's kind of like 1684 01:11:55,770 --> 01:11:54,400 when I were actually started the book 1685 01:11:57,630 --> 01:11:55,780 and when I finished it and stuff like 1686 01:11:59,880 --> 01:11:57,640 it's about four years three or four 1687 01:12:01,530 --> 01:11:59,890 years it's kind of started in a rough 1688 01:12:02,250 --> 01:12:01,540 idea that initially and like maybe you 1689 01:12:03,990 --> 01:12:02,260 should write this and 1690 01:12:06,930 --> 01:12:04,000 kept on collecting stuff and then that 1691 01:12:08,759 --> 01:12:06,940 was about four year process if you 1692 01:12:10,439 --> 01:12:08,769 looked at me and met me for years you 1693 01:12:13,500 --> 01:12:10,449 know at the beginning of the genesis of 1694 01:12:18,390 --> 01:12:13,510 this I was very stressed and very 1695 01:12:20,370 --> 01:12:18,400 anxious person I'm not like you're 1696 01:12:24,080 --> 01:12:20,380 perfect by any means now but that the 1697 01:12:29,160 --> 01:12:24,090 act of writing this book formally 1698 01:12:31,140 --> 01:12:29,170 putting all this down as I'm a much 1699 01:12:33,740 --> 01:12:31,150 calmer person right now I'm a much 1700 01:12:37,140 --> 01:12:33,750 calmer person right now and I'm also I 1701 01:12:39,870 --> 01:12:37,150 mean I'm like like I was greeting my 1702 01:12:41,729 --> 01:12:39,880 teeth at a certain chapter when I was 1703 01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:41,739 first starting out like oh my gosh is 1704 01:12:45,330 --> 01:12:43,090 this really where it's going and all 1705 01:12:48,419 --> 01:12:45,340 this like new AG stuff and all this like 1706 01:12:50,370 --> 01:12:48,429 consciousness often and I and I just was 1707 01:12:52,680 --> 01:12:50,380 like and I just kind of pull I gotta 1708 01:12:55,859 --> 01:12:52,690 follow these threads and in doing so I 1709 01:12:57,750 --> 01:12:55,869 feel like I mean what's the term 1710 01:12:59,549 --> 01:12:57,760 mystical that's such a silly word and 1711 01:13:01,169 --> 01:12:59,559 such an easy catchphrase but I feel like 1712 01:13:05,339 --> 01:13:01,179 I'm much more open to the mystical now 1713 01:13:07,979 --> 01:13:05,349 than I ever would have been then and so 1714 01:13:11,490 --> 01:13:07,989 yes I feel like I'm calmer I feel like 1715 01:13:13,229 --> 01:13:11,500 I'm much more at peace with the mystery 1716 01:13:15,240 --> 01:13:13,239 the mysteries not solved I don't I don't 1717 01:13:18,870 --> 01:13:15,250 plan on solving the mystery but I'm much 1718 01:13:23,189 --> 01:13:18,880 more calm with the mystery now and then 1719 01:13:28,859 --> 01:13:23,199 I'm also and I'm very hesitant to say 1720 01:13:31,410 --> 01:13:28,869 this but it feels like this book wrote 1721 01:13:33,029 --> 01:13:31,420 itself I mean obviously I pushed the 1722 01:13:34,589 --> 01:13:33,039 keys on the keyboard and type all the 1723 01:13:36,479 --> 01:13:34,599 words out and wrestled with it and did 1724 01:13:38,580 --> 01:13:36,489 spellcheck and then cleaned up the you 1725 01:13:47,520 --> 01:13:38,590 know grammatical stuff and mm-hmm but I 1726 01:13:51,359 --> 01:13:47,530 I feel like this book like landed in my 1727 01:13:53,790 --> 01:13:51,369 lap yeah in a way where all I did was a 1728 01:13:55,620 --> 01:13:53,800 form of like sort of transcription I did 1729 01:13:56,370 --> 01:13:55,630 as chant I did not channel the book that 1730 01:13:59,189 --> 01:13:56,380 would be incorrect 1731 01:14:01,919 --> 01:13:59,199 but I did something similar where this 1732 01:14:03,479 --> 01:14:01,929 book just arrived magically I would say 1733 01:14:05,310 --> 01:14:03,489 like I just need a story this chapter 1734 01:14:07,169 --> 01:14:05,320 isn't working I just need one story to 1735 01:14:09,270 --> 01:14:07,179 connect this part in this part and then 1736 01:14:11,359 --> 01:14:09,280 boom that I would check my email that 1737 01:14:14,759 --> 01:14:11,369 story would arrive I drop it in place 1738 01:14:16,060 --> 01:14:14,769 that chapter would be done the whole 1739 01:14:19,300 --> 01:14:16,070 book was like that 1740 01:14:20,440 --> 01:14:19,310 it wasn't easy but I feel like I did 1741 01:14:21,070 --> 01:14:20,450 it's funny I said I didn't do any 1742 01:14:24,400 --> 01:14:21,080 research 1743 01:14:26,170 --> 01:14:24,410 all I did was get up in the morning and 1744 01:14:28,150 --> 01:14:26,180 open my email inbox and this stuff just 1745 01:14:31,150 --> 01:14:28,160 flooded in exactly the perfect story its 1746 01:14:34,450 --> 01:14:31,160 exact perfect moment I totally get that 1747 01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:34,460 I totally get that I used to well I used 1748 01:14:38,260 --> 01:14:36,290 to have to write a lot of articles I 1749 01:14:40,500 --> 01:14:38,270 used to you know work at a magazine and 1750 01:14:42,340 --> 01:14:40,510 that sort of thing and I'm one of those 1751 01:14:45,010 --> 01:14:42,350 procrastinators 1752 01:14:46,630 --> 01:14:45,020 but I'm always I felt like I was sort of 1753 01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:46,640 working on it because it felt like it 1754 01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:48,890 was percolating in my head but when I 1755 01:14:52,510 --> 01:14:50,810 would sit down to finally write it would 1756 01:14:57,430 --> 01:14:52,520 usually be around midnight on the night 1757 01:15:00,190 --> 01:14:57,440 before my deadline and when once I it 1758 01:15:02,230 --> 01:15:00,200 felt like it just fell out of me you 1759 01:15:04,570 --> 01:15:02,240 know and so I I would feel like I 1760 01:15:08,200 --> 01:15:04,580 couldn't take any credit for it because 1761 01:15:11,500 --> 01:15:08,210 it didn't feel like I really wrote it is 1762 01:15:13,360 --> 01:15:11,510 that sort of what you mean it's like and 1763 01:15:16,810 --> 01:15:13,370 I used to write music same thing 1764 01:15:19,060 --> 01:15:16,820 especially lyrics and you know they 1765 01:15:21,400 --> 01:15:19,070 would just sort of come out like I 1766 01:15:23,620 --> 01:15:21,410 wouldn't think of them so much as they 1767 01:15:25,900 --> 01:15:23,630 would just sort of I sit there and sort 1768 01:15:28,420 --> 01:15:25,910 of and again I don't consider myself a 1769 01:15:30,280 --> 01:15:28,430 channel or either but is that sort of 1770 01:15:31,930 --> 01:15:30,290 what it was like well sure I do 1771 01:15:33,970 --> 01:15:31,940 illustration work and I'm you know as 1772 01:15:36,520 --> 01:15:33,980 life worked as an artist and I think 1773 01:15:38,800 --> 01:15:36,530 that's the anyone who's been in the 1774 01:15:40,090 --> 01:15:38,810 creative process knows or that magical 1775 01:15:41,980 --> 01:15:40,100 moment when it all flows together any 1776 01:15:48,580 --> 01:15:41,990 songwriter or any painter and you know 1777 01:15:50,140 --> 01:15:48,590 you know that's sure but this was a big 1778 01:15:51,760 --> 01:15:50,150 book to fall together like that it 1779 01:15:53,680 --> 01:15:51,770 wasn't like a little song or a little 1780 01:15:55,300 --> 01:15:53,690 drawing you know a this was a big 1781 01:15:56,470 --> 01:15:55,310 complex thing that seemed to fall 1782 01:15:57,850 --> 01:15:56,480 together like that and I've talked to 1783 01:15:59,560 --> 01:15:57,860 other authors and they say oh that's the 1784 01:16:01,120 --> 01:15:59,570 best books always seem to work out that 1785 01:16:02,380 --> 01:16:01,130 way so in a way I'm not doing anything 1786 01:16:05,740 --> 01:16:02,390 that no one else has done but it was 1787 01:16:09,100 --> 01:16:05,750 very powerful experience for me to sort 1788 01:16:13,720 --> 01:16:09,110 of trust that magic I guess yeah yeah 1789 01:16:15,580 --> 01:16:13,730 definitely definitely I'm trying to find 1790 01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:15,590 out what they're referring to in the 1791 01:16:21,550 --> 01:16:18,890 chat room sky is asking she said uh 1792 01:16:26,430 --> 01:16:21,560 knowing I wish ranae would ask him if he 1793 01:16:28,840 --> 01:16:26,440 feels like he has that a deeper knowing 1794 01:16:30,040 --> 01:16:28,850 sure I have a deeper knowing I guess 1795 01:16:31,780 --> 01:16:30,050 then I did before it's 1796 01:16:33,550 --> 01:16:31,790 that's elusive it's hard to put my can't 1797 01:16:35,320 --> 01:16:33,560 define it but I feel like I have what I 1798 01:16:37,930 --> 01:16:35,330 basically could say is like I know that 1799 01:16:41,190 --> 01:16:37,940 the universe is much more multi-layered 1800 01:16:44,380 --> 01:16:41,200 much more complicated much more playful 1801 01:16:47,200 --> 01:16:44,390 then I would have then I would have 1802 01:16:51,250 --> 01:16:47,210 admitted you know a few years ago and 1803 01:16:53,650 --> 01:16:51,260 this is and this is connected to my UFO 1804 01:16:55,780 --> 01:16:53,660 contact experiences this is connected to 1805 01:16:58,180 --> 01:16:55,790 the owl stuff this is connected to my 1806 01:16:59,860 --> 01:16:58,190 being open to like asking these 1807 01:17:01,480 --> 01:16:59,870 questions and researching this stuff so 1808 01:17:05,080 --> 01:17:01,490 yes there's something much more playful 1809 01:17:08,440 --> 01:17:05,090 and alive and and dynamic and and 1810 01:17:10,810 --> 01:17:08,450 multi-layered multi-dimensional about 1811 01:17:14,680 --> 01:17:10,820 about reality the fabric of reality 1812 01:17:17,290 --> 01:17:14,690 itself and and so I can't define it I 1813 01:17:19,150 --> 01:17:17,300 can't I can't like draw a diagram of it 1814 01:17:21,460 --> 01:17:19,160 on it on a chalkboard for a physics 1815 01:17:27,250 --> 01:17:21,470 class but in my core in my heart I know 1816 01:17:28,570 --> 01:17:27,260 that right right so you know and you and 1817 01:17:30,220 --> 01:17:28,580 you're gonna be continuing on with your 1818 01:17:32,110 --> 01:17:30,230 research you're gonna have another book 1819 01:17:35,590 --> 01:17:32,120 coming out you'll keep us posted on that 1820 01:17:40,390 --> 01:17:35,600 for sure cause we'd love to have you 1821 01:17:43,210 --> 01:17:40,400 back when that does happen and so for 1822 01:17:47,110 --> 01:17:43,220 you what is your you know sort of 1823 01:17:49,360 --> 01:17:47,120 biggest takeaway for yourself from all 1824 01:17:53,710 --> 01:17:49,370 this do you feel like somehow you're a 1825 01:17:55,030 --> 01:17:53,720 better person for this oh I just I mean 1826 01:17:56,620 --> 01:17:55,040 I feel like I'm proud of myself for 1827 01:17:59,020 --> 01:17:56,630 sticking to it in me and putting this 1828 01:18:00,160 --> 01:17:59,030 book out I'm proud of it yeah so so here 1829 01:18:02,740 --> 01:18:00,170 I'll just tell you one little story from 1830 01:18:04,000 --> 01:18:02,750 the book here that's that's uh and I 1831 01:18:09,940 --> 01:18:04,010 usually don't share this one because 1832 01:18:14,200 --> 01:18:09,950 it's so personal in a way I was um got a 1833 01:18:15,430 --> 01:18:14,210 letter from a woman she's now a happy 1834 01:18:17,950 --> 01:18:15,440 grandmother's and I'm now happy 1835 01:18:19,570 --> 01:18:17,960 grandmother and she said but at the time 1836 01:18:24,310 --> 01:18:19,580 and my teenagers which sure been in the 1837 01:18:26,770 --> 01:18:24,320 early 70s I was very depressed and I was 1838 01:18:29,200 --> 01:18:26,780 gonna kill myself and I had planned to 1839 01:18:31,240 --> 01:18:29,210 commit suicide and I had a spot picked 1840 01:18:33,820 --> 01:18:31,250 out I was gonna drive there was a little 1841 01:18:34,870 --> 01:18:33,830 spot in the woods just pull off the road 1842 01:18:36,910 --> 01:18:34,880 and there's little spot there 1843 01:18:38,980 --> 01:18:36,920 I had it all picked out I drove in the 1844 01:18:40,870 --> 01:18:38,990 car I had a hose in the car and I had a 1845 01:18:42,910 --> 01:18:40,880 piccolo so I could I could take the hose 1846 01:18:44,160 --> 01:18:42,920 from the tailpipe and bring it into the 1847 01:18:45,840 --> 01:18:44,170 exhaust into the 1848 01:18:49,080 --> 01:18:45,850 and then I could lay my head on the 1849 01:18:51,540 --> 01:18:49,090 pillow and she's driving to the spot and 1850 01:18:54,270 --> 01:18:51,550 she's slowing down and she's just about 1851 01:18:58,800 --> 01:18:54,280 to turn into the spot in a white owl 1852 01:19:00,479 --> 01:18:58,810 flies up right at a windshield and she 1853 01:19:02,729 --> 01:19:00,489 said hovered there it beat its wings and 1854 01:19:07,080 --> 01:19:02,739 hovered there and she locked eyes with 1855 01:19:10,950 --> 01:19:07,090 this owl she said for 15 seconds and the 1856 01:19:13,649 --> 01:19:10,960 owl flew off she said she had a good cry 1857 01:19:17,189 --> 01:19:13,659 and she turned around went home and 1858 01:19:19,050 --> 01:19:17,199 she's alive so this is this is the snow 1859 01:19:23,689 --> 01:19:19,060 UFO in this story but that story has 1860 01:19:27,630 --> 01:19:23,699 everything to do with this 1861 01:19:30,390 --> 01:19:27,640 this subject in a way for me I mean this 1862 01:19:33,600 --> 01:19:30,400 is a woman who was brought back from the 1863 01:19:37,020 --> 01:19:33,610 brink of death by the symbol of death 1864 01:19:38,729 --> 01:19:37,030 the owl so yeah I just like I that I'm 1865 01:19:40,790 --> 01:19:38,739 so grateful that woman reached out to me 1866 01:19:46,410 --> 01:19:40,800 and it was a beautiful perfect story and 1867 01:19:49,050 --> 01:19:46,420 and I and I I recognized the power and 1868 01:19:54,000 --> 01:19:49,060 that there's no UFOs in that but it but 1869 01:19:55,830 --> 01:19:54,010 it has but but it it so whatever's going 1870 01:19:56,850 --> 01:19:55,840 on and I believe her the reason I 1871 01:19:59,189 --> 01:19:56,860 believers because I've heard that story 1872 01:20:03,959 --> 01:19:59,199 in some form or another so many times 1873 01:20:06,600 --> 01:20:03,969 now so yeah this is remarkable stuff Wow 1874 01:20:08,630 --> 01:20:06,610 you know I when I was asking you about 1875 01:20:12,419 --> 01:20:08,640 how it had changed you you know I 1876 01:20:14,640 --> 01:20:12,429 noticed over time you know working in 1877 01:20:17,820 --> 01:20:14,650 the UFO field you know with the magazine 1878 01:20:19,680 --> 01:20:17,830 and the in the SERO group and in other 1879 01:20:21,570 --> 01:20:19,690 things other research that that I've 1880 01:20:24,890 --> 01:20:21,580 been involved in you know had a chance 1881 01:20:28,020 --> 01:20:24,900 to over a period of even decades now 1882 01:20:32,100 --> 01:20:28,030 know people involved in the UFO field 1883 01:20:33,930 --> 01:20:32,110 and seen them you know know them you 1884 01:20:37,979 --> 01:20:33,940 know years ago and know them now and 1885 01:20:41,760 --> 01:20:37,989 I've seen sort of an evolution a lot of 1886 01:20:45,870 --> 01:20:41,770 times with with UFO experiencers or 1887 01:20:49,160 --> 01:20:45,880 abductees whatever you want to whatever 1888 01:20:54,120 --> 01:20:49,170 term you want to use where it seems like 1889 01:20:57,750 --> 01:20:54,130 there seems to be um is this nut sand 1890 01:21:00,690 --> 01:20:57,760 bolts UFO researchers as we called them 1891 01:21:04,910 --> 01:21:00,700 and but they ended up sort of evolving 1892 01:21:10,020 --> 01:21:09,330 way do you relate to that at all oh 1893 01:21:14,400 --> 01:21:10,030 absolutely 1894 01:21:17,760 --> 01:21:14,410 even even people like astronauts that 1895 01:21:19,470 --> 01:21:17,770 I've known and you know had the you know 1896 01:21:22,170 --> 01:21:19,480 pleasure to be able to speak with an 1897 01:21:25,800 --> 01:21:22,180 interview and things like that it seems 1898 01:21:29,250 --> 01:21:25,810 like you know over time they they change 1899 01:21:33,510 --> 01:21:29,260 and they become much more reflective 1900 01:21:35,970 --> 01:21:33,520 much more spiritual and much more you 1901 01:21:39,600 --> 01:21:35,980 know in in the metaphysical realm than 1902 01:21:41,310 --> 01:21:39,610 they ever were before and that was I was 1903 01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:41,320 that was the knob that was the thing 1904 01:21:45,180 --> 01:21:42,850 with it you know I had to move past 1905 01:21:47,130 --> 01:21:45,190 knowledge in order to find out that 1906 01:21:48,810 --> 01:21:47,140 that's the same little thing that 1907 01:21:53,090 --> 01:21:48,820 happened with my iPad you know this 1908 01:21:57,720 --> 01:21:53,100 technical thing you know what became a 1909 01:21:59,850 --> 01:21:57,730 mystical metaphor yep yep that's a very 1910 01:22:03,479 --> 01:21:59,860 poignant thing there you know moving 1911 01:22:06,990 --> 01:22:03,489 past the knowledge that's very clear you 1912 01:22:10,890 --> 01:22:07,000 know I get that so well because it's not 1913 01:22:13,320 --> 01:22:10,900 really knowledge and it's more like ask 1914 01:22:16,650 --> 01:22:13,330 I said in the chat room it's a knowing 1915 01:22:18,320 --> 01:22:16,660 but it's not knowledge it's not facts 1916 01:22:20,820 --> 01:22:18,330 and figures 1917 01:22:22,080 --> 01:22:20,830 yeah and it's it I've just absorbed you 1918 01:22:24,420 --> 01:22:22,090 know like that's how I make a joke you 1919 01:22:26,190 --> 01:22:24,430 know like people say like like well what 1920 01:22:27,510 --> 01:22:26,200 do you have proof for this like how do 1921 01:22:28,620 --> 01:22:27,520 you know this is real it's like you want 1922 01:22:30,920 --> 01:22:28,630 to know if it's real come and look at my 1923 01:22:34,320 --> 01:22:30,930 email inbox that's all sure it's real 1924 01:22:35,729 --> 01:22:34,330 and and I'm just at this point in my own 1925 01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:35,739 experiences and just hearing these 1926 01:22:43,890 --> 01:22:41,890 stories it's I'm I'm wow there's a very 1927 01:22:47,310 --> 01:22:43,900 real connection between owls and UFOs 1928 01:22:49,350 --> 01:22:47,320 very cool well at that we got to end the 1929 01:22:51,600 --> 01:22:49,360 music it's rolling I want to thank you 1930 01:22:53,610 --> 01:22:51,610 Mike Cleland and I've really enjoyed 1931 01:22:56,520 --> 01:22:53,620 your book the messengers owls 1932 01:22:59,400 --> 01:22:56,530 synchronicity and the UFO FFT I would 1933 01:23:01,200 --> 01:22:59,410 suggest that my listeners get this book 1934 01:23:04,350 --> 01:23:01,210 is it's a great book to have it's great 1935 01:23:06,030 --> 01:23:04,360 book to have in your library so thank 1936 01:23:08,070 --> 01:23:06,040 you so much once again Mike it takes 1937 01:23:08,520 --> 01:23:08,080 everybody for listening have a good 1938 01:23:10,280 --> 01:23:08,530 night 1939 01:23:17,760 --> 01:23:10,290 thanks so much